MR. SHERIDAN TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.St. James's, May 21st, 1782.Dear Grenville,You are certainly one of the best negotiators that ever negotiated; and so says the King, your royal master, who is going to send you the fine silver box which you receive with this, and which, with great envy, I learn is your property; and which, if the serious modesty of your former despatch could have been seriously construed, you would not have been entitled to. Though I have not written before, have not my punctuality and remembrance appeared conspicuous in the newspapers you receive? These tell you all the private news, and all that isimportant of public you will have heard before you receive this; so this must be a very short letter, and indeed the messenger is almost going; and Charles has been writing to you, which is another reason for my saying very little. Mr. Oswald talks very sanguinely about Franklin, and says he is more open to you than he has been to any one; but he is a Scotsman, and belonging to Lord Shelburne. If the business of an American treaty seemed likely to prosper in your hands, I should not think it improbable that Lord Shelburne would try to thwart it. Oswald had not yet seen Lord Shelburne; and by his cajoling manner toour secretaryand eagerness to come to him, I do not feel much prejudiced in his favour; but probably I judge wrongly whenever the other secretary is concerned, for I grow suspicious of him in every respect, the more I see of every transaction of his.I am just told that the messenger is ready, so more in my next. There is no particular news. The Dutch are got back to the Texel. Lord Howe still off there, but nothing likely to come of it. Sir G. Rodney, notwithstanding his victory, is to be recalled, and Pigott is sailed. This I think very magnanimous in the Ministers or very impolitic; events must justify, but it is putting themselves too much in their power.We had a good illumination for this news. You see how we go on in Parliament by the papers; we were bullied outrageously about our poor Parliamentary Reform; but it will do at last, in spite of you all.Yours ever sincerely,R.B. Sheridan.
MR. SHERIDAN TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.
St. James's, May 21st, 1782.
Dear Grenville,
You are certainly one of the best negotiators that ever negotiated; and so says the King, your royal master, who is going to send you the fine silver box which you receive with this, and which, with great envy, I learn is your property; and which, if the serious modesty of your former despatch could have been seriously construed, you would not have been entitled to. Though I have not written before, have not my punctuality and remembrance appeared conspicuous in the newspapers you receive? These tell you all the private news, and all that isimportant of public you will have heard before you receive this; so this must be a very short letter, and indeed the messenger is almost going; and Charles has been writing to you, which is another reason for my saying very little. Mr. Oswald talks very sanguinely about Franklin, and says he is more open to you than he has been to any one; but he is a Scotsman, and belonging to Lord Shelburne. If the business of an American treaty seemed likely to prosper in your hands, I should not think it improbable that Lord Shelburne would try to thwart it. Oswald had not yet seen Lord Shelburne; and by his cajoling manner toour secretaryand eagerness to come to him, I do not feel much prejudiced in his favour; but probably I judge wrongly whenever the other secretary is concerned, for I grow suspicious of him in every respect, the more I see of every transaction of his.
I am just told that the messenger is ready, so more in my next. There is no particular news. The Dutch are got back to the Texel. Lord Howe still off there, but nothing likely to come of it. Sir G. Rodney, notwithstanding his victory, is to be recalled, and Pigott is sailed. This I think very magnanimous in the Ministers or very impolitic; events must justify, but it is putting themselves too much in their power.
We had a good illumination for this news. You see how we go on in Parliament by the papers; we were bullied outrageously about our poor Parliamentary Reform; but it will do at last, in spite of you all.
Yours ever sincerely,
R.B. Sheridan.
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLEDear Grenville,If your letter of the 10th a little damped me in my hopes of good effects from your journey, that of the 19th, which I havejust received, together with Mr. Oswald's conversation, has very much revived me. I send away the messenger, for fear of the delays which Cabinets are so apt to cause; but I hope you will hear from us again very soon, with authority to offer the Independence as unconditionally as you can wish. Mr. Oswald says that Dr. Franklin is much inclined to confide in you; if so, ask him at once in what manner we can act so as to gain a substantial, if not a nominal, peace with America; and you may depend upon all my influence in support of his advice.I hope you will not be disappointed at our adhering to our first ideas for the propositionweare to make, rather than offering concessions. Ifweare to offer, we think it is not for us to throw concessions at their head; but if they do not like our proposals, it is forthemto ask such as may be reasonable. If what they propose is really so, there is no doubt of our complying; and if it is not, or they should refuse to make any offer at all, it will surely be clear who was most in earnest in his wishes for peace; and we must make the best advantage we can of our situation, about which I begin to be more sanguine than I used to do.From your letter, there are surely great hopes of detaching America; and from those we have just received from Petersburg, there appears the most favourable disposition in that quarter to enforce a peace with Holland; or if that cannot be, to take a decisive part. And I know how much this disposition will be increased, if we can fully convince His Imperial Majesty that the failure of your negotiation is not our fault.With regard to all your diffidence of yourself, we laugh at it. If, in order to save yourself bodily labour, you want a secretary, write, and you shall have one; but for any other purpose, you want no assistance, but are allowed by everybody, and the King in particular, to be the best writer of despatches that is known in this office.Adieu. I envy you the pleasure of announcing the news from the West Indies, with all the modest insolence which belongs to the occasion.Yours most affectionately,----Pray make my best respects to Dr. Franklin, whose letter to me contained some very promising expressions. Assure him that, in spite of all that has happened, he and I are still of the same country.St. James's, Tuesday night,May 21st, 1782.
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE
Dear Grenville,
If your letter of the 10th a little damped me in my hopes of good effects from your journey, that of the 19th, which I havejust received, together with Mr. Oswald's conversation, has very much revived me. I send away the messenger, for fear of the delays which Cabinets are so apt to cause; but I hope you will hear from us again very soon, with authority to offer the Independence as unconditionally as you can wish. Mr. Oswald says that Dr. Franklin is much inclined to confide in you; if so, ask him at once in what manner we can act so as to gain a substantial, if not a nominal, peace with America; and you may depend upon all my influence in support of his advice.
I hope you will not be disappointed at our adhering to our first ideas for the propositionweare to make, rather than offering concessions. Ifweare to offer, we think it is not for us to throw concessions at their head; but if they do not like our proposals, it is forthemto ask such as may be reasonable. If what they propose is really so, there is no doubt of our complying; and if it is not, or they should refuse to make any offer at all, it will surely be clear who was most in earnest in his wishes for peace; and we must make the best advantage we can of our situation, about which I begin to be more sanguine than I used to do.
From your letter, there are surely great hopes of detaching America; and from those we have just received from Petersburg, there appears the most favourable disposition in that quarter to enforce a peace with Holland; or if that cannot be, to take a decisive part. And I know how much this disposition will be increased, if we can fully convince His Imperial Majesty that the failure of your negotiation is not our fault.
With regard to all your diffidence of yourself, we laugh at it. If, in order to save yourself bodily labour, you want a secretary, write, and you shall have one; but for any other purpose, you want no assistance, but are allowed by everybody, and the King in particular, to be the best writer of despatches that is known in this office.
Adieu. I envy you the pleasure of announcing the news from the West Indies, with all the modest insolence which belongs to the occasion.
Yours most affectionately,
----
Pray make my best respects to Dr. Franklin, whose letter to me contained some very promising expressions. Assure him that, in spite of all that has happened, he and I are still of the same country.
St. James's, Tuesday night,
May 21st, 1782.
MR. SHERIDAN TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.St. James's, May 26th, 1782.My dear Grenville,Charles not being well, I write to you at his desire, that you may not be surprized at having no private letter from him with the despatch which Mr. Oswald brings you. There is not room, I believe, for much communication of any very private nature on the subject of your instructions and situation, as his public letter, you will see, is very sincerely to the purpose. If anything in it admits of modification, or is not to be very literally taken, I should conceive it to be the recommendation of explicitness with Oswald; on which subject I own I have suggested doubts; and Charles wishes you to have a caution for your own discretion to make use of.I perceive uniformly (from our intercepted information) that all thesecitynegotiators—Mr. Wentworths, Bourdeaux, &c.—insinuate themselves into these sort of affairs merely for private advantages, and make their trust principally subservient to stock-jobbing views, on which subject there appears to be a surprising communication with Paris. Mr. Oswald's officiousnessin bringing over your despatch and other things I have been told since by those who know him, lead me to form this kind of opinion of him; but you will judge where this will apply to any confidence that should be placed in him.Surely, whatever the preliminaries of a treaty for peace with France may be, it would be our interest, if we could, to drop even mentioning the Americans in them; at least the seeming to grant anything to them as at the requisition of France. France now denies our ceding Independence to America to be anything given to them, and declines to allow anything for it. In my opinion it would be wiser in them to insist ostentatiously (and even to make a point of allowing something for it) on the Independence of America being as the first article of their treating; and this would for ever furnish them with a claim on the friendship and confidence of the Americans after the peace. But since they do not do this, surely it would not be bad policy, even if we gave up more to France in other respects, to prevent her appearing in the treaty as in any respect the champion of America, or as having made any claims for her; we giving her up everything she wants equally, and her future confidence and alliance being such an object to us. Were I the Minister, I would give France an island or two to choose, if it would expose her selfishness, sooner than let her gain theesteem of the Americansby claiming anything essential for them in apparent preference to her own interest and ambition. All people, of all descriptions, in America, will read the treaty of peace, whenever it comes, which France shall make with this country; and if they should see there that she has claimed and got a good deal for herself, but has not appeared to have thought of them, however they may have profited in fact, it would certainly give us a great advantage in those sort of arguments and competitions which will arise after a peace; whereas if it appears as a stipulated demand on the part of France that America should be independent, it will forever be a most handy record and argument for the French party in that country to work with; and this, as things stand now, and as far as my poor judgment goes, appears not to be a very difficult thing to have either way. And so these are my politics on that subject for you.You will find Rodney has taken some more ships. The unluckiness of his recal, I think, appears to increase in its ill effect; and people don't seem to fancy Pigott. Rolle has given notice that he will move on Thursday to know who advised His Majesty to recal Rodney; and out of doors the talk is the same. Charles gave Johnson, who had been very violent on this subject the other day, an excellent trimming; but there was a good deal of coy with the other.The arming plan don't seem to take at all. We have not yet heard from Ireland since Burgoyne took them over a constitution.[1]There is nothing odd or new to tell you, but that here is a most untimely strange sort of an influenza which every creature catches. You must not mind the badness of my scrawl: and let me hear from you. Does Lafayette join your consultation dinners with Franklin, as some of our Roupell intelligence sets forth? I take it for granted the French Ministers will think it a point of spirit to seem rather less desirous of peace since your defeat in the West?Howe is still off the Texel, and the Dutch safe within.What mere politics I write to you! One might as well be a newspaper editor at once, I believe, as anything that politics can make one: but all other pursuits are as idle and unsatisfactory, and that's a comfort.Yours ever,R. B. Sheridan.
MR. SHERIDAN TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.
St. James's, May 26th, 1782.
My dear Grenville,
Charles not being well, I write to you at his desire, that you may not be surprized at having no private letter from him with the despatch which Mr. Oswald brings you. There is not room, I believe, for much communication of any very private nature on the subject of your instructions and situation, as his public letter, you will see, is very sincerely to the purpose. If anything in it admits of modification, or is not to be very literally taken, I should conceive it to be the recommendation of explicitness with Oswald; on which subject I own I have suggested doubts; and Charles wishes you to have a caution for your own discretion to make use of.
I perceive uniformly (from our intercepted information) that all thesecitynegotiators—Mr. Wentworths, Bourdeaux, &c.—insinuate themselves into these sort of affairs merely for private advantages, and make their trust principally subservient to stock-jobbing views, on which subject there appears to be a surprising communication with Paris. Mr. Oswald's officiousnessin bringing over your despatch and other things I have been told since by those who know him, lead me to form this kind of opinion of him; but you will judge where this will apply to any confidence that should be placed in him.
Surely, whatever the preliminaries of a treaty for peace with France may be, it would be our interest, if we could, to drop even mentioning the Americans in them; at least the seeming to grant anything to them as at the requisition of France. France now denies our ceding Independence to America to be anything given to them, and declines to allow anything for it. In my opinion it would be wiser in them to insist ostentatiously (and even to make a point of allowing something for it) on the Independence of America being as the first article of their treating; and this would for ever furnish them with a claim on the friendship and confidence of the Americans after the peace. But since they do not do this, surely it would not be bad policy, even if we gave up more to France in other respects, to prevent her appearing in the treaty as in any respect the champion of America, or as having made any claims for her; we giving her up everything she wants equally, and her future confidence and alliance being such an object to us. Were I the Minister, I would give France an island or two to choose, if it would expose her selfishness, sooner than let her gain theesteem of the Americansby claiming anything essential for them in apparent preference to her own interest and ambition. All people, of all descriptions, in America, will read the treaty of peace, whenever it comes, which France shall make with this country; and if they should see there that she has claimed and got a good deal for herself, but has not appeared to have thought of them, however they may have profited in fact, it would certainly give us a great advantage in those sort of arguments and competitions which will arise after a peace; whereas if it appears as a stipulated demand on the part of France that America should be independent, it will forever be a most handy record and argument for the French party in that country to work with; and this, as things stand now, and as far as my poor judgment goes, appears not to be a very difficult thing to have either way. And so these are my politics on that subject for you.
You will find Rodney has taken some more ships. The unluckiness of his recal, I think, appears to increase in its ill effect; and people don't seem to fancy Pigott. Rolle has given notice that he will move on Thursday to know who advised His Majesty to recal Rodney; and out of doors the talk is the same. Charles gave Johnson, who had been very violent on this subject the other day, an excellent trimming; but there was a good deal of coy with the other.
The arming plan don't seem to take at all. We have not yet heard from Ireland since Burgoyne took them over a constitution.[1]
There is nothing odd or new to tell you, but that here is a most untimely strange sort of an influenza which every creature catches. You must not mind the badness of my scrawl: and let me hear from you. Does Lafayette join your consultation dinners with Franklin, as some of our Roupell intelligence sets forth? I take it for granted the French Ministers will think it a point of spirit to seem rather less desirous of peace since your defeat in the West?
Howe is still off the Texel, and the Dutch safe within.
What mere politics I write to you! One might as well be a newspaper editor at once, I believe, as anything that politics can make one: but all other pursuits are as idle and unsatisfactory, and that's a comfort.
Yours ever,
R. B. Sheridan.
[1]The Duke of Rutland had been appointed by the new Ministry Lord-Lieutenant in Ireland and General Burgoyne Commander-in-Chief there.
[1]The Duke of Rutland had been appointed by the new Ministry Lord-Lieutenant in Ireland and General Burgoyne Commander-in-Chief there.
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.Dear Grenville,I have only time to write a line to tell you that I have received your letter by Gregson, and also that by the post containing the letters that passed between M. de Vergennes and you. I do not choose to tell you anything more of my opinion by this conveyance, than that all you have done is perfectly and exactly right, and that His Majesty is of the same opinion.Rolle moved yesterday, and Rosewarne seconded, a sort of censure on the recal of Rodney, and Lord North made such a figure as made even his enemies pity him; he showed such a desire to support the motion, without daring to do it, as was perfectly ridiculous. Adieu!Yours, ever affectionately,C. J. F.We are all surprised at your not knowing the great news on the 24th, which was the date of your letter by Gregson.Every account from Ireland is pleasant to the greatest degree.St. James's, May 31st, 1782
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.
Dear Grenville,
I have only time to write a line to tell you that I have received your letter by Gregson, and also that by the post containing the letters that passed between M. de Vergennes and you. I do not choose to tell you anything more of my opinion by this conveyance, than that all you have done is perfectly and exactly right, and that His Majesty is of the same opinion.
Rolle moved yesterday, and Rosewarne seconded, a sort of censure on the recal of Rodney, and Lord North made such a figure as made even his enemies pity him; he showed such a desire to support the motion, without daring to do it, as was perfectly ridiculous. Adieu!
Yours, ever affectionately,
C. J. F.
We are all surprised at your not knowing the great news on the 24th, which was the date of your letter by Gregson.
Every account from Ireland is pleasant to the greatest degree.
St. James's, May 31st, 1782
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.Paris, June 4th, 1782.Dear Charles,Thepublicletter which I send to you by Lauzun, is, as you will see, of no other use than that of accounting for his journey, and enabling him to carry to you thisprivateone, of which I had once almost determined to be myself the bearer; an apprehension, however, that so sudden an arrival might beembarrassing to you, has decided me not to take that step, till I had explained to you my reasons for wishing to do so, though I should not care to write them, except in the full confidence that they will be seen by no person whatever but yourself. Recollect always that this letter is written in that confidence, and I am sure I never can repent of having sent it.You will easily see, from the tenor of the correspondence we have hitherto had, that what little use I could be of to you here, appeared to me to be in the communication that I had with Franklin; I considered the rest of the negotiation as dependent upon that, and the only possible immediate advantages which were to be expected, seemed to me to rest in the jealousy which the French Court would entertain of not being thoroughly supported in everything by America. The degree of confidence which Franklin seemed inclined to place in me, and which he expressed to me more than once in the strongest terms, very much favoured this idea, and encouraged me in wishing to learn from him what might be in future ground for a partial connection between England and America; I say in future, because I have hitherto never much believed in any treaty of the year 1782; and my expectation, even from the strongest of Franklin's expressions, was not of an immediate turn in our favour, or any positive advantage from the Commissioners in Europe, till the people in America should cry out to them, from seeing that England was meeting their wishes. It was in this light, too, that I saw room to hope for some good effects from a voluntary offer of unconditional independence to America, a chance which looked the more tempting as I own I considered the sacrifice as but a small one, and such as, had I been an American, I had thought myself little obliged to Great Britain in this moment for granting, except from an idea that if it was an article of treaty, it would have been as much given by France as by England. I repeat this only toremind you that, from these considerations, the whole of my attention has been given to Franklin, and that I should have considered myself as losing my time here, if it had not been directed to that subject.I believe I told you in my last, that I had very sanguine expectations of Franklin's being inclined to speak out when I should see him next; indeed, he expressly told me, that he would think over all the points likely to establish a solid reconciliation between England and America, and that he would write his mind upon them, in order that we might examine them together more in order; confiding, as he said, in me, that I would not state them as propositions from him, but as being my own ideas of what would be useful to both countries. (I interrupt myself here to remind you of the obligation I must put you under not to mention this). For this very interesting communication, which I had long laboured to get, he fixed the fourth day, which was last Saturday; but on Friday morning, Mr. Oswald came, and having given me your letters, he went immediately to Franklin, to carry some to him. I kept my appointment at Passy the next morning, and in order to give Franklin the greatest confidence, and at the same time, too, not knowing how much Mr. Oswald might have told him, I began with saying, that though under the difficulty which M. de Ve. and he himself had made to my full power, it was not the moment as a politician, perhaps, to make farther explanations till that difficulty should be relieved; yet, to show him the confidence I put in him, I would begin by telling him that I was authorized to offer the independence in the first instance, instead of making it an article of general treaty. He expressed great satisfaction at this, especially, he said, because, by having done otherwise, we should have seemed to have considered America as in the same degree of connection with France which she had been under with us; whereas, Americawished to be considered as a power, free and clear to all the world. But when I came to lead the discourse to the subject which he had promised four days before, I was a good deal mortified to find him put it off altogether till he should be more ready; and notwithstanding my reminding him of his promise, he only answered that it should be in some days. What passed between Mr. Oswald and me will explain to you the reason of this disappointment.Mr. Oswald told me that Lord Shelburne had proposed to him, when last in England, to take a commission to treat with the American Ministers; that upon his mentioning it to Franklin now, it seemed perfectly agreeable to him, and even to be what he had very much wished; Mr. Oswald adding that he wished only to assist the business, and had no other view; he mixed with this a few regrets that there should be any difference between the two offices; and when I asked upon what subject, he said, owing to the Buckingham party being too ready to give up everything.You will observe though, for it is on that account that I give you this narrative, that this intended appointment has effectually stopped Franklin's mouth to me; and that when he is told that Mr. Oswald is to be the Commissioner to treat with him, it is but natural that he should reserve his confidence for the quarter so pointed out to him; nor does this secret seem only known to Franklin; as Lafayette said, laughing, yesterday, that he had just leftLord Shelburne's ambassadorat Passy. Indeed, this is not the first moment of a separate and private negotiation; for Mr. Oswald, suspecting, by something that I dropped, that Franklin had talked to me about Canada, (though, by the bye, he never had), told me this circumstance as follows. When he was in England, the last time but one, he carried with him a paper, entrusted to him by Franklin, under condition that it should be shown only to Lord Shelburne,and returned into his own hands at Passy; this paper, under the title of "Notes of a Conversation," contained an idea of Canada being spontaneously ceded by England to the Thirteen Provinces, in order that Congress might sell the unappropriated lands, and make a fund thereby, in order to compensate the damages done by the English army, and even those sustained too by the royalists. This paper, given with many precautions, for fear of its being known to the French Court, to whom it was supposed not to be agreeable, Mr. Oswald showed to Lord Shelburne, who, after keeping it a day, as Mr. Oswald supposes to show to the King, returned it to him, and it was by him brought back to Franklin.I say nothing to the proposition itself, to the impolicy of bringing a strange neighbourhood to the Newfoundland Fishery, or to the little reason that England would naturally see in having lost thirteen provinces to give away a fourteenth; but I mention it to show you an early trace of separate negotiation, which perhaps you did not before know. Under these circumstances, I felt very much tempted to go over and explain them to youvivâ vocerather than by letter, and I must say, with the farther intention of suggesting to you the only idea that seems likely to answer your purpose, and it is this: the Spanish Ambassador will in a day or two have the powers from his Court; the Americans are here, so are the French; why should you not consider this then as a Congress in full form, and send here a person of rank, such as Lord Fitzwilliam, if he would come, so as to have the whole negotiation in the hands of one person; you would by that means recover within your compass the essential part which is now out of it; nor do I see how Lord Shelburne could object to such an appointment, which would in every respect very much facilitate the business. Let me press this a little strongly to you, for another reason: you may depend upon it, people here have already got an idea of adifference between the two offices, and consider how much that idea will be assisted by the embarrassments arising from two people negotiating to the same purpose, but under different and differing authorities, concealing and disguising from each other what with the best intentions they could hardly make known, and common enough to each. I am almost afraid of pressing this as strongly as I should, for fear you should think me writing peevishly; but if I did not state the thing to you in the situation in which I see it, I should think I was betraying your interests instead of giving attention to them. I must entreat you very earnestly to consider this, to see the impossibility of my assisting you under this contrariety, to see how much the business itself will suffer if carried on with the jealousy of these clashing interests, and to see whether it may not all be prevented by some such single appointment in high rank as that I mentioned;au reste, I cannot but say that I feel much easier with the hope of making over what remains of this business. I begin to feel it weighty, and you know how much I dislike thepublicityyou packed off to me in that confounded silver box; I could not bring myself to say anything civil about it in my last letter, and you ought to give me credit for great self-denial in not taking this opportunity of telling you my own story at the Secretary's office, as nothing but the embarrassment it might give you upon the sudden, prevented me. Once more, I tell you I cannot fight a daily battle with Mr. Oswald andhis secretary; it would be neither for the advantage of the business, for your interest, or your credit or mine; and even if it was, I could not do it.Concluding then the American business as out of the question, whichpersonallyI cannot be sorry for, you surely have but one of two things to do: either to adopt the proposition of a newdignifiedpeer's appointment, which being single, may bring back the business to you by comprehending it all in one;or Lord Shelburne must have his minister here, and Mr. Fox his; by doing which, Mr. Fox will be pretty near as much out of the secret, at least of what is most essential, as if he had nobody here; and the only real gainers by it will be the other Ministers, who cannot fail to profit of such a jumble. Besides which, upon this latter part of the subject, I must very seriously entreat you not to ask me to keep a situation here, in no circumstances pleasant, and in none less so than those I have described. The grievance is a very essential one, the remedy is Lord Fitzwilliam.Adieu. I recommend to Lauzun to make all the haste he can, as I shall not stir a step till you answer this letter, and my step then will, I hope, be towards you. Sheridan's letter of suspicion was written, as you see, in the spirit of prophecy. I owe him an answer, which, by word of mouth or word of letter, he shall have very soon. The news of the day is, that the Cadiz fleet, twenty-six of the line and five French, are sailed for Brest, but I rather imagine they have no authentic account of it yet.I enclose to you P. Guemené's offer of some good champagne; if you choose to have any, tell me what number of bottles, and let Brooks or somebody let me know how they are to be sent to England. I don't understand champagne, but this has a good character.Adieu. Let Lord Fitzwilliam answer my letter.
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.
Paris, June 4th, 1782.
Dear Charles,
Thepublicletter which I send to you by Lauzun, is, as you will see, of no other use than that of accounting for his journey, and enabling him to carry to you thisprivateone, of which I had once almost determined to be myself the bearer; an apprehension, however, that so sudden an arrival might beembarrassing to you, has decided me not to take that step, till I had explained to you my reasons for wishing to do so, though I should not care to write them, except in the full confidence that they will be seen by no person whatever but yourself. Recollect always that this letter is written in that confidence, and I am sure I never can repent of having sent it.
You will easily see, from the tenor of the correspondence we have hitherto had, that what little use I could be of to you here, appeared to me to be in the communication that I had with Franklin; I considered the rest of the negotiation as dependent upon that, and the only possible immediate advantages which were to be expected, seemed to me to rest in the jealousy which the French Court would entertain of not being thoroughly supported in everything by America. The degree of confidence which Franklin seemed inclined to place in me, and which he expressed to me more than once in the strongest terms, very much favoured this idea, and encouraged me in wishing to learn from him what might be in future ground for a partial connection between England and America; I say in future, because I have hitherto never much believed in any treaty of the year 1782; and my expectation, even from the strongest of Franklin's expressions, was not of an immediate turn in our favour, or any positive advantage from the Commissioners in Europe, till the people in America should cry out to them, from seeing that England was meeting their wishes. It was in this light, too, that I saw room to hope for some good effects from a voluntary offer of unconditional independence to America, a chance which looked the more tempting as I own I considered the sacrifice as but a small one, and such as, had I been an American, I had thought myself little obliged to Great Britain in this moment for granting, except from an idea that if it was an article of treaty, it would have been as much given by France as by England. I repeat this only toremind you that, from these considerations, the whole of my attention has been given to Franklin, and that I should have considered myself as losing my time here, if it had not been directed to that subject.
I believe I told you in my last, that I had very sanguine expectations of Franklin's being inclined to speak out when I should see him next; indeed, he expressly told me, that he would think over all the points likely to establish a solid reconciliation between England and America, and that he would write his mind upon them, in order that we might examine them together more in order; confiding, as he said, in me, that I would not state them as propositions from him, but as being my own ideas of what would be useful to both countries. (I interrupt myself here to remind you of the obligation I must put you under not to mention this). For this very interesting communication, which I had long laboured to get, he fixed the fourth day, which was last Saturday; but on Friday morning, Mr. Oswald came, and having given me your letters, he went immediately to Franklin, to carry some to him. I kept my appointment at Passy the next morning, and in order to give Franklin the greatest confidence, and at the same time, too, not knowing how much Mr. Oswald might have told him, I began with saying, that though under the difficulty which M. de Ve. and he himself had made to my full power, it was not the moment as a politician, perhaps, to make farther explanations till that difficulty should be relieved; yet, to show him the confidence I put in him, I would begin by telling him that I was authorized to offer the independence in the first instance, instead of making it an article of general treaty. He expressed great satisfaction at this, especially, he said, because, by having done otherwise, we should have seemed to have considered America as in the same degree of connection with France which she had been under with us; whereas, Americawished to be considered as a power, free and clear to all the world. But when I came to lead the discourse to the subject which he had promised four days before, I was a good deal mortified to find him put it off altogether till he should be more ready; and notwithstanding my reminding him of his promise, he only answered that it should be in some days. What passed between Mr. Oswald and me will explain to you the reason of this disappointment.
Mr. Oswald told me that Lord Shelburne had proposed to him, when last in England, to take a commission to treat with the American Ministers; that upon his mentioning it to Franklin now, it seemed perfectly agreeable to him, and even to be what he had very much wished; Mr. Oswald adding that he wished only to assist the business, and had no other view; he mixed with this a few regrets that there should be any difference between the two offices; and when I asked upon what subject, he said, owing to the Buckingham party being too ready to give up everything.
You will observe though, for it is on that account that I give you this narrative, that this intended appointment has effectually stopped Franklin's mouth to me; and that when he is told that Mr. Oswald is to be the Commissioner to treat with him, it is but natural that he should reserve his confidence for the quarter so pointed out to him; nor does this secret seem only known to Franklin; as Lafayette said, laughing, yesterday, that he had just leftLord Shelburne's ambassadorat Passy. Indeed, this is not the first moment of a separate and private negotiation; for Mr. Oswald, suspecting, by something that I dropped, that Franklin had talked to me about Canada, (though, by the bye, he never had), told me this circumstance as follows. When he was in England, the last time but one, he carried with him a paper, entrusted to him by Franklin, under condition that it should be shown only to Lord Shelburne,and returned into his own hands at Passy; this paper, under the title of "Notes of a Conversation," contained an idea of Canada being spontaneously ceded by England to the Thirteen Provinces, in order that Congress might sell the unappropriated lands, and make a fund thereby, in order to compensate the damages done by the English army, and even those sustained too by the royalists. This paper, given with many precautions, for fear of its being known to the French Court, to whom it was supposed not to be agreeable, Mr. Oswald showed to Lord Shelburne, who, after keeping it a day, as Mr. Oswald supposes to show to the King, returned it to him, and it was by him brought back to Franklin.
I say nothing to the proposition itself, to the impolicy of bringing a strange neighbourhood to the Newfoundland Fishery, or to the little reason that England would naturally see in having lost thirteen provinces to give away a fourteenth; but I mention it to show you an early trace of separate negotiation, which perhaps you did not before know. Under these circumstances, I felt very much tempted to go over and explain them to youvivâ vocerather than by letter, and I must say, with the farther intention of suggesting to you the only idea that seems likely to answer your purpose, and it is this: the Spanish Ambassador will in a day or two have the powers from his Court; the Americans are here, so are the French; why should you not consider this then as a Congress in full form, and send here a person of rank, such as Lord Fitzwilliam, if he would come, so as to have the whole negotiation in the hands of one person; you would by that means recover within your compass the essential part which is now out of it; nor do I see how Lord Shelburne could object to such an appointment, which would in every respect very much facilitate the business. Let me press this a little strongly to you, for another reason: you may depend upon it, people here have already got an idea of adifference between the two offices, and consider how much that idea will be assisted by the embarrassments arising from two people negotiating to the same purpose, but under different and differing authorities, concealing and disguising from each other what with the best intentions they could hardly make known, and common enough to each. I am almost afraid of pressing this as strongly as I should, for fear you should think me writing peevishly; but if I did not state the thing to you in the situation in which I see it, I should think I was betraying your interests instead of giving attention to them. I must entreat you very earnestly to consider this, to see the impossibility of my assisting you under this contrariety, to see how much the business itself will suffer if carried on with the jealousy of these clashing interests, and to see whether it may not all be prevented by some such single appointment in high rank as that I mentioned;au reste, I cannot but say that I feel much easier with the hope of making over what remains of this business. I begin to feel it weighty, and you know how much I dislike thepublicityyou packed off to me in that confounded silver box; I could not bring myself to say anything civil about it in my last letter, and you ought to give me credit for great self-denial in not taking this opportunity of telling you my own story at the Secretary's office, as nothing but the embarrassment it might give you upon the sudden, prevented me. Once more, I tell you I cannot fight a daily battle with Mr. Oswald andhis secretary; it would be neither for the advantage of the business, for your interest, or your credit or mine; and even if it was, I could not do it.
Concluding then the American business as out of the question, whichpersonallyI cannot be sorry for, you surely have but one of two things to do: either to adopt the proposition of a newdignifiedpeer's appointment, which being single, may bring back the business to you by comprehending it all in one;or Lord Shelburne must have his minister here, and Mr. Fox his; by doing which, Mr. Fox will be pretty near as much out of the secret, at least of what is most essential, as if he had nobody here; and the only real gainers by it will be the other Ministers, who cannot fail to profit of such a jumble. Besides which, upon this latter part of the subject, I must very seriously entreat you not to ask me to keep a situation here, in no circumstances pleasant, and in none less so than those I have described. The grievance is a very essential one, the remedy is Lord Fitzwilliam.
Adieu. I recommend to Lauzun to make all the haste he can, as I shall not stir a step till you answer this letter, and my step then will, I hope, be towards you. Sheridan's letter of suspicion was written, as you see, in the spirit of prophecy. I owe him an answer, which, by word of mouth or word of letter, he shall have very soon. The news of the day is, that the Cadiz fleet, twenty-six of the line and five French, are sailed for Brest, but I rather imagine they have no authentic account of it yet.
I enclose to you P. Guemené's offer of some good champagne; if you choose to have any, tell me what number of bottles, and let Brooks or somebody let me know how they are to be sent to England. I don't understand champagne, but this has a good character.
Adieu. Let Lord Fitzwilliam answer my letter.
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.(Private.)St James's, June 10th, 1782.Dear Grenville,I received late the night before last your very interesting letter of the 4th, and you will easily conceive am not a little embarrassed by its contents. In the first place, it was notpossible to comply with your injunction of perfect secrecy in a case where steps of such importance are necessary to be taken; and therefore I have taken upon me (for which I must trust to your friendship to excuse me) to show your letter to Lord Rockingham, the Duke of Richmond and Lord John, who are all as full of indignation at its contents as one might reasonably expect honest men to be. We are perfectly resolved to come to an explanation upon the business, if it is possible so to do, without betraying any confidence reposed in me by you, or in you by others.The two principal points which occur are the paper relative to Canada, of which I had never heard till I received your letter, and the intended investment of Mr. Oswald with full powers, which was certainly meant for the purpose of diverting Franklin's confidence from you into another channel. With these two points we wish to charge Shelburne directly; but pressing as the King is, and interesting as it is both to our own situations and to the affairs of the public—which are, I fear, irretrievably injured by this intrigue, and which must be ruined if it is suffered to go on—we are resolved not to stir a step till we hear again from you, and know precisely how far we are at liberty to make use of what you have discovered. If this matter should produce a rupture, and consequently become more or less the subject of public discussion, I am sensible the Canada paper cannot be mentioned by name; but might it not be said that we had discovered that Shelburne had withheld from our knowledge matters of importance to the negotiation? And with respect to the other point, might it not be said, without betraying anybody, that while the King had one avowed and authorized Minister at Paris, measures were taken for lessening his credit and for obstructing his inquiries by announcing a new intended commission, of which the Cabinet here had never been apprized.Do, pray, my dear Grenville, consider the incredible importance of this business in every view, and write me word precisely how far you can authorize us to make use of your intelligence. It is more than possible that, before this reaches you, many other circumstances may have occurred which may afford further proofs of this duplicity of conduct; and if they have, I am sure they will not have escaped your observation. If this should be the case, you will see the necessity of acquainting me with them as soon as possible. You see what is our object, and you can easily judge what sort of evidence will be most useful to us. When the object is attained—that is, when the duplicity is proved—to what consequences we ought to drive; whether to an absolute rupture, or merely to the recal of Oswald and the simplification of this negotiation, is a point that may be afterwards considered. I own I incline to the more decisive measure, and so I think do those with whom I must act in concert.I am very happy indeed that you did not come yourself: the mischief that would have happened from it to our affairs are incredible; and I must beg of you, nay, entreat and conjure you, not to think of taking any precipitate step of this nature. As to the idea of replacing you with Lord Fitzwilliam, not only it would be very objectionable on account of the mistaken notion it would convey of things being much riper than they are, but it would, as I conceive, be no remedy to the evil. Whether the King's Minister at Paris be an Ambassador Extraordinary or a Minister Plenipotentiary, can make no difference as to the question. The clandestine manner of carrying on a separate negotiation, which we complain of, would be equally practicable and equally blameable if Lord Fitzwilliam was Ambassador, as it is now that Mr. Grenville is Plenipotentiary. I must therefore again entreat you, as a matter of personal kindness to me, to remain a little longer atParis; if you were to leave it, all sorts of suspicions would be raised. It is of infinite consequence that we should have it to say that we have done all in our power to make peace, not only with regard to what may be expected from America, but from Europe.The King of Prussia is certainly inclined to be our friend; but he urges and presses to make peace if possible. If we could once bring the treaty to such a point as that, stating the demands on each side to him, we could have his approbation for breaking it off, I think it not impossible but the best consequences might follow; and with regard to North America, it is surely clear to demonstration, that it is of infinite consequence that it should be publicly understood who is to blame if the war continues. I do hope, therefore, that you will at all events stay long enough to make your propositions, and to call upon them to make others in return. I know your situation cannot be pleasant; but as you first undertook it in a great measure from friendship to me, so let me hope that the same motive will induce you to continue in it at least for some time.What will be the end of this, God knows; but I am sure you will agree with me, that we cannot suffer a system to go on which is not only dishonourable to us, but evidently ruinous to the affairs of the country. In this instance, the mischief done by intercepting, as it were, the very useful information we expected through you from Franklin, is I fear in a great degree irremediable; but it is our business, and indeed our duty, to prevent such things for the future.Everything in Ireland goes on very well; and I really think there is good reason to entertain hopes from Prussia and Russia, if your negotiation either goes on or goes off as it ought to do.I can hardly read Monsieur de Guemené's letter, but wish to have two hundred bottles of the champagne, if there is reallyreason to think it good. By the way, I beg you will remember me to Monsieur de Guemené, and put him in mind of our former acquaintance in the Rue St. Pierre. If the wine in question is as good as that he used to rob from Monsieur de Soubise, I shall be very well satisfied. I will give Brooks directions to acquaint you with the proper manner of sending it. I am quite ashamed of dwelling so long upon this, after the very serious business of this letter; but you know I cannot help being a friend to thepoor abuses; and besides, in a political light, good wine is no mean ingredient in keeping one's friends in good humour and steady to the cause.I am,My dear Grenville,Yours most affectionately,C. J. Fox.
MR. FOX TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.
(Private.)
St James's, June 10th, 1782.
Dear Grenville,
I received late the night before last your very interesting letter of the 4th, and you will easily conceive am not a little embarrassed by its contents. In the first place, it was notpossible to comply with your injunction of perfect secrecy in a case where steps of such importance are necessary to be taken; and therefore I have taken upon me (for which I must trust to your friendship to excuse me) to show your letter to Lord Rockingham, the Duke of Richmond and Lord John, who are all as full of indignation at its contents as one might reasonably expect honest men to be. We are perfectly resolved to come to an explanation upon the business, if it is possible so to do, without betraying any confidence reposed in me by you, or in you by others.
The two principal points which occur are the paper relative to Canada, of which I had never heard till I received your letter, and the intended investment of Mr. Oswald with full powers, which was certainly meant for the purpose of diverting Franklin's confidence from you into another channel. With these two points we wish to charge Shelburne directly; but pressing as the King is, and interesting as it is both to our own situations and to the affairs of the public—which are, I fear, irretrievably injured by this intrigue, and which must be ruined if it is suffered to go on—we are resolved not to stir a step till we hear again from you, and know precisely how far we are at liberty to make use of what you have discovered. If this matter should produce a rupture, and consequently become more or less the subject of public discussion, I am sensible the Canada paper cannot be mentioned by name; but might it not be said that we had discovered that Shelburne had withheld from our knowledge matters of importance to the negotiation? And with respect to the other point, might it not be said, without betraying anybody, that while the King had one avowed and authorized Minister at Paris, measures were taken for lessening his credit and for obstructing his inquiries by announcing a new intended commission, of which the Cabinet here had never been apprized.
Do, pray, my dear Grenville, consider the incredible importance of this business in every view, and write me word precisely how far you can authorize us to make use of your intelligence. It is more than possible that, before this reaches you, many other circumstances may have occurred which may afford further proofs of this duplicity of conduct; and if they have, I am sure they will not have escaped your observation. If this should be the case, you will see the necessity of acquainting me with them as soon as possible. You see what is our object, and you can easily judge what sort of evidence will be most useful to us. When the object is attained—that is, when the duplicity is proved—to what consequences we ought to drive; whether to an absolute rupture, or merely to the recal of Oswald and the simplification of this negotiation, is a point that may be afterwards considered. I own I incline to the more decisive measure, and so I think do those with whom I must act in concert.
I am very happy indeed that you did not come yourself: the mischief that would have happened from it to our affairs are incredible; and I must beg of you, nay, entreat and conjure you, not to think of taking any precipitate step of this nature. As to the idea of replacing you with Lord Fitzwilliam, not only it would be very objectionable on account of the mistaken notion it would convey of things being much riper than they are, but it would, as I conceive, be no remedy to the evil. Whether the King's Minister at Paris be an Ambassador Extraordinary or a Minister Plenipotentiary, can make no difference as to the question. The clandestine manner of carrying on a separate negotiation, which we complain of, would be equally practicable and equally blameable if Lord Fitzwilliam was Ambassador, as it is now that Mr. Grenville is Plenipotentiary. I must therefore again entreat you, as a matter of personal kindness to me, to remain a little longer atParis; if you were to leave it, all sorts of suspicions would be raised. It is of infinite consequence that we should have it to say that we have done all in our power to make peace, not only with regard to what may be expected from America, but from Europe.
The King of Prussia is certainly inclined to be our friend; but he urges and presses to make peace if possible. If we could once bring the treaty to such a point as that, stating the demands on each side to him, we could have his approbation for breaking it off, I think it not impossible but the best consequences might follow; and with regard to North America, it is surely clear to demonstration, that it is of infinite consequence that it should be publicly understood who is to blame if the war continues. I do hope, therefore, that you will at all events stay long enough to make your propositions, and to call upon them to make others in return. I know your situation cannot be pleasant; but as you first undertook it in a great measure from friendship to me, so let me hope that the same motive will induce you to continue in it at least for some time.
What will be the end of this, God knows; but I am sure you will agree with me, that we cannot suffer a system to go on which is not only dishonourable to us, but evidently ruinous to the affairs of the country. In this instance, the mischief done by intercepting, as it were, the very useful information we expected through you from Franklin, is I fear in a great degree irremediable; but it is our business, and indeed our duty, to prevent such things for the future.
Everything in Ireland goes on very well; and I really think there is good reason to entertain hopes from Prussia and Russia, if your negotiation either goes on or goes off as it ought to do.
I can hardly read Monsieur de Guemené's letter, but wish to have two hundred bottles of the champagne, if there is reallyreason to think it good. By the way, I beg you will remember me to Monsieur de Guemené, and put him in mind of our former acquaintance in the Rue St. Pierre. If the wine in question is as good as that he used to rob from Monsieur de Soubise, I shall be very well satisfied. I will give Brooks directions to acquaint you with the proper manner of sending it. I am quite ashamed of dwelling so long upon this, after the very serious business of this letter; but you know I cannot help being a friend to thepoor abuses; and besides, in a political light, good wine is no mean ingredient in keeping one's friends in good humour and steady to the cause.
I am,
My dear Grenville,
Yours most affectionately,
C. J. Fox.
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.(Private.)Paris, June 16th, 1782.Dear Charles,I received your letter of the 10th by Ogg on the night of the 14th, and would have sent him back as immediately as you seemed to wish; but having no other messenger to carry M. de Vergennes's answer, I was obliged to keep him till he could be the bearer of that likewise.I can easily conceive the embarrassment occasioned to you by my letter, and have so much confidence in the honour of the persons to whom you communicated it, that I am not under the smallest uneasiness on that account; the explanation, however, that you wish to come to, certainly has its difficulties; and amongst them some so sacred, that unless they can be kept altogether clear, you cannot but agree with me in thinking that they must be buried at least in silence, though not in oblivion.In order therefore that you may see into every part of this business, I will, as you desire, state in the most explicit manner the circumstances of it, as far as I think they affect any confidence reposed in me.In the first place, then, you will have observed, that although Franklin has actually made me no confidence, owing, as I believe, without doubt, to the reasons I stated, yet as the communication he had said he would make to me was of the most confidential nature, and in full trust that the subjects which he should mention should not be given as propositions coming from him, I think it would be a breach of that confidence to make it known even that he had promised to hold such a conversation with me; and therefore to charge Lord Shelburne with having diverted from me that expected communication, would be to proclaim Franklin's promise to me; which promise, though it has not been followed up, I cannot think myself at liberty to quote. The delicacy of Franklin's situation with respect to the French Court was, as he said, the ground of the caution which he observed, and which, nevertheless, he was once inclined to risk in my trust. He would certainly have both to repent and to complain if anything on my part should lead to betray even the confidential disposition he had entertained. These reasons you will, I am sure, agree with me in considering as decisive against any mention being to be made of the expectations I had formed from the conversation I was to have had with Franklin.The Canada paper is not perhaps quite under the same circumstances. The only knowledge I have of that is from Oswald; and as I before told you, I had it from him at a moment when I fancy he apprehended I had heard or should hear of it from Franklin. No other reason, indeed, can account for his not mentioning it from the end of April till the 31st of May. He told it me under no express limitation ofconfidence: the words in which he introduced it were, "I think it right you should know;" and I am perfectly sure that he asked from me no engagement of secrecy, nor do I conceive myself under any with regard to him, except that general secrecy which is always attached to business of a confidential nature, such as was the business I related to you. I recollect asking whether he had showed the paper to you: he said No; but did not add any injunction to me not to do so; indeed, if he had, I should have stated to him the impossibility of my keeping from you a circumstance of that importance, or of my becoming, by my silence in it, a separate party to a business which it was my duty fully and entirely to lay before you and to receive from you; nor indeed at this moment is the knowledge of it confined to Lord Shelburne; as I am pretty sure Oswald told me that Lord Ashburton was with Lord Shelburne when he, Oswald, asked if he might give any answer to Franklin about the paper, or rather observed that he supposed he could not then have any answer to it. Under these circumstances, the difficulty with regard to the Canada paper, of which I have no copy, lies more possibly in the indelicacy and perhaps bad policy of bringing forward Franklin where he wished so much not to appear, than in the quoting it from me. I do not wish to be quoted, if there exists the least doubt whether I should. But I cannot more exactly explain to you the whole extent of that doubt, than by showing you that it does not exist in any specific obligation on my part, but only in the nature of what was told to me; the subject itself carrying with it, as you will see, many reasons for secrecy, and every mark of it in the manner of conducting it; but as to positive engagement or obligation upon this subject, I have none.The remaining circumstance—of the intention mentioned to Mr. Oswald by Lord Shelburne, of giving him a commission if it should be necessary—stands altogether clear of the slightestshade of difficulty upon the point of confidence; indeed, at the time I wrote you word of it, I did not imagine I was informing you of anything new or unknown to you; and only so far meant to dwell upon it, as to regret its happening precisely at the instant when it was most important it should not. I apprehended that Lord Shelburne might have already expressed such an intention to the rest of the King's Ministers, upon the ground of the American share of this business, which ground, in the present stage of it, I thought possibly you had not found it easy to object to. In this idea it was that Lord Fitzwilliam's appointment occurred to me, not to prevent a clandestine negotiation, but to unite a separated one; always imagining that you knew of, but did not resist, the intended commission to Mr. Oswald, and therefore hinting the expediency of superseding it, by giving to another person an appointment of such rank and magnitude as should include a power which it seems neither for the public interest, nor for yours and your friends' interests, to leave separate and distinct.To return, however, to the point of confidence: upon this last subject there is none; and you are certainly at full liberty to proclaim at Charing Cross that Lord Shelburne told Mr. Oswald he supposed he would not object to a commission if it should be necessary; and that since his last return to Paris, Mr. Oswald has told me he found it very much Franklin's wish likewise. If I may repeat, therefore, in a few words, what I have tried to express to you in a good many, it is that, as to Franklin's first intention of a private and confidential communication with me, I hold myself so engaged in secrecy to him, that I think it would be a breach of confidence in me to have that intention at all spoken of. As to the Canada paper, I leave it, with the comment I have made upon it, altogether to your discretion; and as to the proposed commission, you are certainly at full liberty to say of it what you please. I have itnot in my power to give you any additional proofs of sinister management in this business. I seldom see Oswald, though upon good terms with him; and have seen Franklin, since Oswald's coming, but once, when he was as silent as ever, notwithstanding my reminding him of his promise; so that I cannot help thinking that business altogether irretrievable. But neither do I know what you will gain by forcing Oswald's return; indeed I am inclined to think it might be much more prudent to save appearances by leaving him here, till you shall have completed your purpose of receiving the propositions you wish or the refusal you wish from Versailles. Perhaps, politically speaking, you may not think it wise to make the conduct, or rather misconduct, of a foreign negotiation the ground of a domestic rupture, which may betray too much weakness and disunion; but this is too delicate a subject for me to say anything upon, more than to assure you that, whatever is your determination about it, you will not find me shrink from the part I have or may have to take in it.And one word here about the desire I have expressed to return to England: it is impossible not to say that I feel that desire in the strongest degree. I would not speak peevishly about my disappointment in the unlucky check that I have met with; but I think you will agree that the real service it might have been my good fortune perhaps to have been assisting in, is by that check completely annihilated, nor can any step now taken recover or retrieve it; and that consideration weighs pretty heavily in a situation in itself not agreeable to me. But if I repeat this now, it is to keep you awake to the earnest solicitations I make of returning in the first moment you may think it practicable; till then you need have no apprehension of seeing me, but may trust that no personal motives, however strong, can weigh against the important reasons you state, as well as the desire you express, for my continuing something longer at Paris.I am writing to you on the 16th, waiting impatiently for M. de Vergennes's answer, which he gave me reason to hope I shall have to-morrow.
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.
(Private.)
Paris, June 16th, 1782.
Dear Charles,
I received your letter of the 10th by Ogg on the night of the 14th, and would have sent him back as immediately as you seemed to wish; but having no other messenger to carry M. de Vergennes's answer, I was obliged to keep him till he could be the bearer of that likewise.
I can easily conceive the embarrassment occasioned to you by my letter, and have so much confidence in the honour of the persons to whom you communicated it, that I am not under the smallest uneasiness on that account; the explanation, however, that you wish to come to, certainly has its difficulties; and amongst them some so sacred, that unless they can be kept altogether clear, you cannot but agree with me in thinking that they must be buried at least in silence, though not in oblivion.In order therefore that you may see into every part of this business, I will, as you desire, state in the most explicit manner the circumstances of it, as far as I think they affect any confidence reposed in me.
In the first place, then, you will have observed, that although Franklin has actually made me no confidence, owing, as I believe, without doubt, to the reasons I stated, yet as the communication he had said he would make to me was of the most confidential nature, and in full trust that the subjects which he should mention should not be given as propositions coming from him, I think it would be a breach of that confidence to make it known even that he had promised to hold such a conversation with me; and therefore to charge Lord Shelburne with having diverted from me that expected communication, would be to proclaim Franklin's promise to me; which promise, though it has not been followed up, I cannot think myself at liberty to quote. The delicacy of Franklin's situation with respect to the French Court was, as he said, the ground of the caution which he observed, and which, nevertheless, he was once inclined to risk in my trust. He would certainly have both to repent and to complain if anything on my part should lead to betray even the confidential disposition he had entertained. These reasons you will, I am sure, agree with me in considering as decisive against any mention being to be made of the expectations I had formed from the conversation I was to have had with Franklin.
The Canada paper is not perhaps quite under the same circumstances. The only knowledge I have of that is from Oswald; and as I before told you, I had it from him at a moment when I fancy he apprehended I had heard or should hear of it from Franklin. No other reason, indeed, can account for his not mentioning it from the end of April till the 31st of May. He told it me under no express limitation ofconfidence: the words in which he introduced it were, "I think it right you should know;" and I am perfectly sure that he asked from me no engagement of secrecy, nor do I conceive myself under any with regard to him, except that general secrecy which is always attached to business of a confidential nature, such as was the business I related to you. I recollect asking whether he had showed the paper to you: he said No; but did not add any injunction to me not to do so; indeed, if he had, I should have stated to him the impossibility of my keeping from you a circumstance of that importance, or of my becoming, by my silence in it, a separate party to a business which it was my duty fully and entirely to lay before you and to receive from you; nor indeed at this moment is the knowledge of it confined to Lord Shelburne; as I am pretty sure Oswald told me that Lord Ashburton was with Lord Shelburne when he, Oswald, asked if he might give any answer to Franklin about the paper, or rather observed that he supposed he could not then have any answer to it. Under these circumstances, the difficulty with regard to the Canada paper, of which I have no copy, lies more possibly in the indelicacy and perhaps bad policy of bringing forward Franklin where he wished so much not to appear, than in the quoting it from me. I do not wish to be quoted, if there exists the least doubt whether I should. But I cannot more exactly explain to you the whole extent of that doubt, than by showing you that it does not exist in any specific obligation on my part, but only in the nature of what was told to me; the subject itself carrying with it, as you will see, many reasons for secrecy, and every mark of it in the manner of conducting it; but as to positive engagement or obligation upon this subject, I have none.
The remaining circumstance—of the intention mentioned to Mr. Oswald by Lord Shelburne, of giving him a commission if it should be necessary—stands altogether clear of the slightestshade of difficulty upon the point of confidence; indeed, at the time I wrote you word of it, I did not imagine I was informing you of anything new or unknown to you; and only so far meant to dwell upon it, as to regret its happening precisely at the instant when it was most important it should not. I apprehended that Lord Shelburne might have already expressed such an intention to the rest of the King's Ministers, upon the ground of the American share of this business, which ground, in the present stage of it, I thought possibly you had not found it easy to object to. In this idea it was that Lord Fitzwilliam's appointment occurred to me, not to prevent a clandestine negotiation, but to unite a separated one; always imagining that you knew of, but did not resist, the intended commission to Mr. Oswald, and therefore hinting the expediency of superseding it, by giving to another person an appointment of such rank and magnitude as should include a power which it seems neither for the public interest, nor for yours and your friends' interests, to leave separate and distinct.
To return, however, to the point of confidence: upon this last subject there is none; and you are certainly at full liberty to proclaim at Charing Cross that Lord Shelburne told Mr. Oswald he supposed he would not object to a commission if it should be necessary; and that since his last return to Paris, Mr. Oswald has told me he found it very much Franklin's wish likewise. If I may repeat, therefore, in a few words, what I have tried to express to you in a good many, it is that, as to Franklin's first intention of a private and confidential communication with me, I hold myself so engaged in secrecy to him, that I think it would be a breach of confidence in me to have that intention at all spoken of. As to the Canada paper, I leave it, with the comment I have made upon it, altogether to your discretion; and as to the proposed commission, you are certainly at full liberty to say of it what you please. I have itnot in my power to give you any additional proofs of sinister management in this business. I seldom see Oswald, though upon good terms with him; and have seen Franklin, since Oswald's coming, but once, when he was as silent as ever, notwithstanding my reminding him of his promise; so that I cannot help thinking that business altogether irretrievable. But neither do I know what you will gain by forcing Oswald's return; indeed I am inclined to think it might be much more prudent to save appearances by leaving him here, till you shall have completed your purpose of receiving the propositions you wish or the refusal you wish from Versailles. Perhaps, politically speaking, you may not think it wise to make the conduct, or rather misconduct, of a foreign negotiation the ground of a domestic rupture, which may betray too much weakness and disunion; but this is too delicate a subject for me to say anything upon, more than to assure you that, whatever is your determination about it, you will not find me shrink from the part I have or may have to take in it.
And one word here about the desire I have expressed to return to England: it is impossible not to say that I feel that desire in the strongest degree. I would not speak peevishly about my disappointment in the unlucky check that I have met with; but I think you will agree that the real service it might have been my good fortune perhaps to have been assisting in, is by that check completely annihilated, nor can any step now taken recover or retrieve it; and that consideration weighs pretty heavily in a situation in itself not agreeable to me. But if I repeat this now, it is to keep you awake to the earnest solicitations I make of returning in the first moment you may think it practicable; till then you need have no apprehension of seeing me, but may trust that no personal motives, however strong, can weigh against the important reasons you state, as well as the desire you express, for my continuing something longer at Paris.
I am writing to you on the 16th, waiting impatiently for M. de Vergennes's answer, which he gave me reason to hope I shall have to-morrow.
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.June 21st.I have been waiting day after day, and have not got my answer till a few hours ago. I am sorry to have kept you so long, but you see it was impossible to avoid it. A report prevails that Bougainville is arrived at St. Domingo with two ships, as likewise are the four that were at Curaçao. They add that Rodney had been obliged to burn three of his captured ships. La Motthe Peguet has twice had orders to sail from Brest with his seven ships, and as often been recalled. They expect Guichen soon with the fleet from Cadiz of thirty-two ships: they are said to have sailed on the 4th.Pray tell Sheridan to be more cautious in what he writes by the post. If I had time I should give him a lecture; but I want to send away the messenger.Adieu. Oswald affects to consider me now as fully authorized, but I believe expects different news as soon as the Independence Bill is passed; but I cannot help thinking you had better leave him where he is, for his going away will mend nothing. I have bought your wine.Ever very affectionately yours,T.G.
MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE TO MR. FOX.
June 21st.
I have been waiting day after day, and have not got my answer till a few hours ago. I am sorry to have kept you so long, but you see it was impossible to avoid it. A report prevails that Bougainville is arrived at St. Domingo with two ships, as likewise are the four that were at Curaçao. They add that Rodney had been obliged to burn three of his captured ships. La Motthe Peguet has twice had orders to sail from Brest with his seven ships, and as often been recalled. They expect Guichen soon with the fleet from Cadiz of thirty-two ships: they are said to have sailed on the 4th.
Pray tell Sheridan to be more cautious in what he writes by the post. If I had time I should give him a lecture; but I want to send away the messenger.
Adieu. Oswald affects to consider me now as fully authorized, but I believe expects different news as soon as the Independence Bill is passed; but I cannot help thinking you had better leave him where he is, for his going away will mend nothing. I have bought your wine.
Ever very affectionately yours,T.G.
Within a few days after this letter reached England, the Rockingham Administration had ceased to exist. The Marquis of Rockingham, whose health had been declining for some time, died on the 1st of July, and was succeeded in his title by his nephew, the Earl Fitzwilliam,who is alluded to in these letters by Mr. Thomas Grenville. The first intimation of this event conveyed to the Plenipotentiary at Paris was in a letter from his brother, Lord Temple. The circumstances that immediately followed are detailed in the letters of Lord Temple and Mr. Sheridan, written on the same day, and in a letter from Mr. Fox on the day following. The apprehension expressed by Lord Temple that Fox's resignation would be ascribed by the public to a mean contest for offices was not unfounded; although such a motive cannot be believed to have influenced the mind of that statesman, the conviction of what he felt to be his duty on this occasion being shared by Mr. Sheridan, Mr. Burke, Lord John Cavendish, Lord Althorpe and others, who instantly followed his example. The King's undisguised predilection for Lord Shelburne arose from the nearer agreement of their opinions on the American question, than existed between His Majesty and the Rockingham section of the Cabinet, who were for an unconditional recognition of the independence of America—a proceeding regarded by His Majesty with aversion. The rapidity with which the changes were adopted furnished a sufficient reason for Fox's determination not to act under Lord Shelburne, that nobleman having accepted the appointment to the Treasury immediately on the death of Lord Rockingham, without consultation with his colleagues, and Lord Grantham being appointed in the same unceremonious way to the secretaryship vacated by his Lordship. A remarkable contradiction will be observed in the language held on this occasion by Lord Shelburne, who is reportedby Lord Temple to have stated that he looked naturally to the Treasury, and knew no reason why he should forego it, while to Sheridan he declared that he entered upon the office against his wish.
LORD TEMPLE TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.London, July 4th, TwelveP.M.1782.My Dear Brother,My letters by the post have been so unfortunate, and the subject of the present hour is so important, that I have waited all this day for the certainty of a courier, and I am now promised that one shall be dispatched immediately. I was in the country when I received from Mr. Fox an express with the news of Lord Rockingham's death, and an earnest entreaty to come to town; which I did, and found him anxious for the future arrangements. I told him, in the course of our conversation, that I held myself engaged to support the measures of the body of the Whigs, and deprecated any precipitate resolution, unless there was reason to imagine thatmeasureswould be changed. He told me that a meeting had been held of the four friends of Lord Rockingham; viz., the Duke of Richmond, Lord J. Cavendish, Keppell and himself; that they had agreed to submit the Duke of Portland's name to the King, for the Treasury, but with little hopes of success; that he had writ to other great peers, &c., to come to town, and wished for their opinions; that he took it for granted that Lord Shelburne would insist upon the Treasury, and that the King would support him in that claim; that his idea was to quit immediately, but that others differed upon this, but that he was to see Lord Shelburne, and should then know more. This interview took place, and the first account I had of it was from Lord Shelburne, who came to me in the House of Lords anddesired to tell it to me. He stated general willingness to accommodate, and a fixed determination at all events to adhere to every measure of reform which had been proposed, and to facilitate Cabinet arrangements as far as could be hoped from him; that it was natural that the Treasury should be an object to him, that he knew no reason why he was always to forego, and stated the indisposition of the King's mind to any other person at the head of that board. This was attended with every expression of civility to me, and an earnest wish that I would not decline employment, but would engage in the King's service. To this I made the answer which you can so easily conceive, and told him very fairly my intention to act with the great body of the Whigs; I proceeded to state the inconceivable difficulties attending our situation, the necessity of union, and the certain consequences of a breach between himself and the other great features of the Ministry.I can hardly give you the detail of this very long conversation. It was very free and open on both sides, and convinced me that he was certainly, and at all hazards, to have the situation, of which I hardly had a doubt before. He pledged himself repeatedly to the public measures, and to a variety of details which it is not necessary to state, and left me with every personal expression and many wishes that I would reconsider my answer. The next moment, Fox came to me in the Prince's chamber, and I had nearly as long a conversation with him; he stated his knowledge that Lord Shelburne would succeed to Lord Rockingham, and his idea of throwing up. I stated Lord Shelburne's promises to measures, which I found Lord Shelburne had made to him; but the loss of the object, which was evidently a favourite point with him, seemed to affect him much. I repeated my apprehensions that the people would not stand by him in his attempt to quit upon private grounds, which from their nature would appear to be a quarrel for offices, and not a public measure. He saw all this, and saidthat it had been urged to him by several, but that he was notdetermined. I went into the House of Lords, where I found the Duke of Richmond, who was outrageous at the idea of a resignation, and who went before me in all I had said to Fox upon this subject; and you will easily conceive that this opinion was strengthened by the most explicit speech that I ever heard, which Lord Shelburne gave as his creed and the test of his conduct, and which indeed seemed satisfactory to every one who heard him.This day has opened a new scene: the King declared his intention of giving the Treasury to Lord Shelburne; and it was proposed to Lord J. Cavendish to take the vacant seals, which, from variety of reasons, Lord John declined; and notwithstanding all that the Duke of Richmond could urge, Fox has resigned, and the King has accepted the seals.En nova progenies!Lord Shelburne keeps the Treasury, and it issupposedthat Pitt is his Chancellor of the Exchequer; Duke of Grafton, Lord Camden, Conway, Duke of Richmond and Keppell remain, and mean to go on; who are the two Secretaries are not known. I have had a long conversation just now with the Duke of Richmond, who is unhappy, but determined to go on till the first breach on fair public grounds; and wherever or whenever he finds Lord Shelburne tripping, he has apprized him that he will quit, and the other has agreed to it, with every seeming profession of cordiality; and thus matters stand.My opinion, from all whom I have seen, is that Fox has undone himself with the public; and his most intimate friends seem of the same opinion. I am now to request and desire of you, in the strongest terms, not to return from France till you hear further from me. Fox tells me, that you (being envoy) cannot come without the King's leave; and I must entreat of you, for the sake of the public, and of that Ministry which I trust and hope will still stand its ground, for the great and important objects which we had in view in March last—let meadd, for your own sake—do not spread the alarm of returning till you hear from me again, which you certainly shall in a very short period. With every anxious hope and wish that affection can form,I am,My dear brother,Ever yours,N. T.I am anxious to inform you that the Duke of Richmond has pressed me to take the Secretary of State, as named by all our Whig friends; and I shall accept.[1]This is another reason for wishing you to stay till a few days clear up all our doubts and difficulties, in which I need not say how happy I shall be to see you so, and how cordially I love and esteem you. Adieu, my dear Tom.
LORD TEMPLE TO MR. THOMAS GRENVILLE.
London, July 4th, TwelveP.M.1782.
My Dear Brother,
My letters by the post have been so unfortunate, and the subject of the present hour is so important, that I have waited all this day for the certainty of a courier, and I am now promised that one shall be dispatched immediately. I was in the country when I received from Mr. Fox an express with the news of Lord Rockingham's death, and an earnest entreaty to come to town; which I did, and found him anxious for the future arrangements. I told him, in the course of our conversation, that I held myself engaged to support the measures of the body of the Whigs, and deprecated any precipitate resolution, unless there was reason to imagine thatmeasureswould be changed. He told me that a meeting had been held of the four friends of Lord Rockingham; viz., the Duke of Richmond, Lord J. Cavendish, Keppell and himself; that they had agreed to submit the Duke of Portland's name to the King, for the Treasury, but with little hopes of success; that he had writ to other great peers, &c., to come to town, and wished for their opinions; that he took it for granted that Lord Shelburne would insist upon the Treasury, and that the King would support him in that claim; that his idea was to quit immediately, but that others differed upon this, but that he was to see Lord Shelburne, and should then know more. This interview took place, and the first account I had of it was from Lord Shelburne, who came to me in the House of Lords anddesired to tell it to me. He stated general willingness to accommodate, and a fixed determination at all events to adhere to every measure of reform which had been proposed, and to facilitate Cabinet arrangements as far as could be hoped from him; that it was natural that the Treasury should be an object to him, that he knew no reason why he was always to forego, and stated the indisposition of the King's mind to any other person at the head of that board. This was attended with every expression of civility to me, and an earnest wish that I would not decline employment, but would engage in the King's service. To this I made the answer which you can so easily conceive, and told him very fairly my intention to act with the great body of the Whigs; I proceeded to state the inconceivable difficulties attending our situation, the necessity of union, and the certain consequences of a breach between himself and the other great features of the Ministry.
I can hardly give you the detail of this very long conversation. It was very free and open on both sides, and convinced me that he was certainly, and at all hazards, to have the situation, of which I hardly had a doubt before. He pledged himself repeatedly to the public measures, and to a variety of details which it is not necessary to state, and left me with every personal expression and many wishes that I would reconsider my answer. The next moment, Fox came to me in the Prince's chamber, and I had nearly as long a conversation with him; he stated his knowledge that Lord Shelburne would succeed to Lord Rockingham, and his idea of throwing up. I stated Lord Shelburne's promises to measures, which I found Lord Shelburne had made to him; but the loss of the object, which was evidently a favourite point with him, seemed to affect him much. I repeated my apprehensions that the people would not stand by him in his attempt to quit upon private grounds, which from their nature would appear to be a quarrel for offices, and not a public measure. He saw all this, and saidthat it had been urged to him by several, but that he was notdetermined. I went into the House of Lords, where I found the Duke of Richmond, who was outrageous at the idea of a resignation, and who went before me in all I had said to Fox upon this subject; and you will easily conceive that this opinion was strengthened by the most explicit speech that I ever heard, which Lord Shelburne gave as his creed and the test of his conduct, and which indeed seemed satisfactory to every one who heard him.
This day has opened a new scene: the King declared his intention of giving the Treasury to Lord Shelburne; and it was proposed to Lord J. Cavendish to take the vacant seals, which, from variety of reasons, Lord John declined; and notwithstanding all that the Duke of Richmond could urge, Fox has resigned, and the King has accepted the seals.En nova progenies!Lord Shelburne keeps the Treasury, and it issupposedthat Pitt is his Chancellor of the Exchequer; Duke of Grafton, Lord Camden, Conway, Duke of Richmond and Keppell remain, and mean to go on; who are the two Secretaries are not known. I have had a long conversation just now with the Duke of Richmond, who is unhappy, but determined to go on till the first breach on fair public grounds; and wherever or whenever he finds Lord Shelburne tripping, he has apprized him that he will quit, and the other has agreed to it, with every seeming profession of cordiality; and thus matters stand.
My opinion, from all whom I have seen, is that Fox has undone himself with the public; and his most intimate friends seem of the same opinion. I am now to request and desire of you, in the strongest terms, not to return from France till you hear further from me. Fox tells me, that you (being envoy) cannot come without the King's leave; and I must entreat of you, for the sake of the public, and of that Ministry which I trust and hope will still stand its ground, for the great and important objects which we had in view in March last—let meadd, for your own sake—do not spread the alarm of returning till you hear from me again, which you certainly shall in a very short period. With every anxious hope and wish that affection can form,
I am,My dear brother,Ever yours,N. T.
I am anxious to inform you that the Duke of Richmond has pressed me to take the Secretary of State, as named by all our Whig friends; and I shall accept.[1]This is another reason for wishing you to stay till a few days clear up all our doubts and difficulties, in which I need not say how happy I shall be to see you so, and how cordially I love and esteem you. Adieu, my dear Tom.