Gentlemen,April 15th, 1842.
By Lord Stanley’s desire I send you a copy of Dr. Madden’s Report, on the Gold Coast, and its dependencies.
I am to add, that this is sent to you as being personally interested therein, but that you will be good enough to consider it as entirely confidential.
I have, &c.R. R. Gibbons.
The Report of Dr. Madden forms part of the Appendix to the “Report from the Select Committee on the West Coast of Africa[3],†and although the first official communication which was received by the house of Messrs. Zulueta & Co., it is not inserted, in consequence of its want of connexion with the chief subject of this publication. It is entitled, “Report of Her Majesty’s Commissioner of Inquiry on the State of the British Settlements on the Gold Coast, at Sierra Leone, and the Gambia, with some Observations on the Foreign Slave Trading Factories along the Western Coast of Africa, in the Year 1841;†and sets forth its object asfollows:—
“Pursuant to the instructions of Her Majesty’s Secretary of State for the Colonies, the following matters were duly examined into, and the result of the best consideration that could be given to these subjects will be found in the followingorder:—
“1st. The state and condition of our forts and settlements on the Western Coast of Africa, their trade, population, resources, and government.
“2d. The facilities afforded in these settlements to the foreign slave traders resorting to them, by affording supplies in goods or stores that are essential to the trade.
“3d. The prospects and practicability of emigration from Sierra Leone to our West India Colonies.
“4th. The climate, salubrity, and nature of the locality of our settlements on the Western Coast of Africa: and in addition to these subjects, I have to add the consideration of two very important ones, not specified in my instructions, but which, in their execution, became part and parcel of them, and which I conceived I would not have done my duty had I left unnoticed, or taken no steps to remove the evils connected with them; these subjectsare:—
“1. The existence of slavery in our settlements on the Gold Coast.
“2. The co-operation of British commerce with slave-trade interests, at the factories of notorious slave dealers on the Western Coast of Africa.â€
[3]Vide Part II, p. 9, et seq.
[3]Vide Part II, p. 9, et seq.
In treating of the last subject here mentioned, the following remarksoccur:—
“It is very true the Consolidated Slave Law, the 5th of Geo. IV, comprehends every case of aiding and abetting the slave trade, that I have proposed to have still more formally and specifically prohibited; and there can be no question that any infraction of this law, whether by insuring slave property, selling goods for slave trading objects, lending money, or giving any species of assistance for the promotion of these objects in any court in England, where the case would be tried on its proper merits, and not decided on by a jury implicated or involved in the interests of slavery, that the offender would be convicted of the felony and punished. But few of those employed in judicial situations on the Western Coast of Africa have been persons belonging to the legal professions, and those who did belong to it, and were the advisers of our governors, have not been persons of very profound experience in the law, and the consequence has been that, with few exceptions, our authorities on the Western Coast of Africa hold the opinion that was entertained at Cape Coast as to the legality of aiding and abetting the slave dealers, of supplying them with the goods and stores essential to the purchase of the slaves. The Consolidated Slave Trade Act, of 1824, distinctly states in the very second clause, that it is unlawful ‘in any manner to engage, or to contract to engage, directly or indirectly therein (the slave trade), as a partner, agent, or otherwise, or to ship, tranship, lade, receive, or put on board, &c.... knowing that such ship, vessel, or boat is actually employed, &c.’....
“In the 7th clause, with the customary verbiage, it is declared, that ‘if any person shall knowingly and wilfully ship, or put on board of any vessel any money, goods, or effects, to be employed in accomplishing any of the objects hereinbefore declared unlawful, then and in every other such case the person so offending, and their procurers, counsellors, aiders, and abettors, shall forfeit and pay for every such offence double the value of all the money, goods, or effects so shipped,transhipped, laden, received, or put on board, or contracted so to be as aforesaid.’
“And by the 10th clause, the persons thus aiding and abetting the slave trade, are further declared to be felons, and shall be transported for a term not exceeding fourteen years, or confined and kept to hard labour for a term not exceeding five years, nor less than three years, at the discretion of the Court.
“The right and privilege heretofore exercised of suing in Vice-Admiralty Courts for the forfeitures or penalties incurred by the contravention of this law, are set forth in the 12th clause, notwithstanding any criminal proceedings that may have been instituted against the aiders and abettors of this trade. That the merchant in the case of the Dos Amigos had left himself subject to both sorts of proceedings there can be no doubt. In a case somewhat analogous to this, of recent occurrence, a British vessel, commanded by a British subject, the Augusta, dispatched by a London house, was captured by Lieutenant Hill, of Her Majesty’s ship Saracen, having merchandise on board adapted for the slave trading factories, and having a direct destination to one of these. The vessel was condemned at Sierra Leone, but no proceedings have been taken in the Vice-admiralty Court in England by Lieutenant Hill, to recover the penalties incurred by this breach of the law. The notoriety of this vessel at all the factories on the coast of Africa had its weight in the tribunal where she was ultimately condemned for aiding and abetting the slave trade. In no respect was the evidence against this vessel stronger than that against the Cape Coast merchant, yet that vessel was condemned by the authorities at Sierra Leone, and the merchant is defended by those at Cape Coast. The Augusta, a notorious slaver, had only been captured and sent to England a few months before under the name of the Gollupchik, and under Russian colours, and she was found again on the coast, under the British flag, the property of London merchants. The Spanish slave trader, who was captain of the Gollupchik, when captured by the Saracen, and sent to England was subsequently taken near Whydah by Commodore Tucker of the Wolverine, while I was passenger on board that vessel, in another slaver called the Liberal; and from this man I learned particulars entirely corroborative of the documentary evidence found on board the Augusta. The recent relinquishment of the slave trade on the part of Don Theodore Canot at his slave factory at New Sesters, one of the principal slave dealers on the Kroo Coast, led to the giving up of his books and papers to Lieutenant Segrim, of Her Majesty’s ship Termagant, with whom he entered into arrangements for renouncing his unlawful trade; and, on examining these books on board of Her Majesty’s ship Wolverine, I found that a London house had long been in the habit of supplying stores and merchandise to his slave factory from their vessels on the coast. On the 4th of December, 1839, there is an entry of the arrival at his factory, for the purposes of trade, of the English brig Enterprise.
“1st January, 1840. There is an entry of the arrival of an English brig ‘Corcyra,’ belonging to another house in London,for the purposes of trade, and of having purchased of him 50 guns, 100 cutlasses, 100 large kettles, and 100 bars of irons.
“13th May, 1840. There is an entry of the re-appearance of the captain of the ‘Enterprise,’ at his factory, and having purchased from him 83 cruces of rice, or about 2,000lbs. weight, for which he paid 63 dollars, and 84 dollars for 21 guns.
“1st July, 1840. There is an entry of the arrival of the English schooner ‘Gil Blas,’ of London, and of having purchased two pieces of cloth, eight bars of tobacco, and one gallon of rum.
“On the 5th of December, 1840, Don Theodore Canot placed himself under the protection of the British flag, renounced his traffic, and gave up 104 slaves to Lieutenant Segrim.
“Lieutenant Hill, of Her Majesty’s ship ‘Saracen,’ on the 14th January, 1839, visited the British vessel ‘Medora,’ and was informed by the master that he had just disposed at the Gallinas of 10,000 dollars’ worth of goods to the factories there.
“Lieutenant Segrim, of the ‘Termagant,’ recently boarded the British merchant vessel ‘The Guinea Man,’ and the master admitted having just sold 500l.worth of goods to the slave trade factories at the Gallinas.
“A British trader, a man of colour, who has an establishment at Accra, has one likewise at Little Popoe, where he is known to dabble in this trade.
“This man was an agent of a mercantile house in London; and information reached me of his having embarked for Popoe some time ago, in the neighbourhood of St. Paul’s, a number of slaves on board a British vessel then under discharge. On visiting this part of the coast in Her Majesty’s ship ‘Wolverine,’ on my way to Princes’ Island, we found at Great Popoe a British subject of colour holding a factory, from which Captain Tucker had information he had lately shipped a cargo of slaves. While at anchor off the shore, Captain Tucker addressed a letter to him on the subject, informing him of the report he had heard, and giving him to understand that, on any repetition of his illegal proceedings, he would destroy his factory and carry himself to Sierra Leone. He returned a submissive, and I must add a very proper answer, not denying the transaction alluded to, but promising faithfully in future to abstain from exporting slaves.
“I have noticed these circumstances, though not apparently bearing on the subject of this part of my Report, namely, the resources, trade, and government of our settlements on the Gold Coast, and the influence of the latter on the adjoining districts, in order to show the necessity there is for a new enactment to prevent the facilities that are now afforded by our commerce from supplying the slave trade factories with these commodities which are indispensable to the slave traders. It is evident that those factories are supplied with goods by British traders, and especially by London merchants, to a very great extent.†...
London, 31st July, 1841.
(signed)R. R. Madden.
My Lord,London, 25 April, 1842.
Aletter has been addressed to us under date of the 15th inst., by Mr. R. R. Gibbons, sending to us, at your Lordship’s desire, a copy of Dr. Madden’s Report on the Gold Coast of Africa, and its dependencies, and stating that this is done in consideration of “our being personally interested therein, but that we are to consider it as entirely confidential.â€
In common with all other merchants in this city, we may of course be said to possess more or less of a professional interest in all matters which relate to commerce.
As having occasionally executed shipping orders for ports in the coast of Africa, on foreign account, of lawful merchandise, lawfully, and therefore publicly cleared at Her Majesty’s Customs, in lawful vessels, and as far as we, as mere shipping agents, could be supposed or expected to know, to the best of our knowledge, for no unlawful purpose, without any other interest or emolument in the operation antecedent or subsequent to the shipment than that of the simple and regular commission usually charged in, or legitimately connected with the invoice, and possessing no control, direct or indirect, over either vessels or goods, from the moment they left the shores of Great Britain, we may perhaps be supposed to feel a more direct interest in whatsoever throws light on the subject of trade with ports with which, in the course of our mercantile career, we may have had general business transactions, although they have not been either extensive or frequent.
Still more as shippers, in the form and capacity just described, and in no other, of a cargo consisting not only of legal, but even unsuspected merchandise on board the English schooner Augusta, Captain Jennings, the Report of Dr. Madden, as a document in which the capture of that vessel is alluded to, may also be supposed to form an interesting piece of information, whatever its merits may be in other respects.
Such is the nature and the extent of the interest which we acknowledge to possess in the Report of Dr. Madden, neither more nor less; and we submit that, in describing it as personal, a supposition is advanced which, considering the nature of that Report, we have reason to deem unfavourable to our characters, which the facts will not justify, and which we may say, even appearances will not warrant.
The Report brings together a number of transactions, not one of which have we even the remotest knowledge until the perusal of it, with the sole exception of the case of the Augusta. Now, as when looking at them together as a whole, and in conjunction with theother facts, most probably equally unknown to us, which in the course of the investigation now carried on before the Committee may be brought forward, there is no telling to what extent the association of our name with the matters of the Report may be carried, we have thought it right to explain to your Lordship what kind of interest we have no objection to be supposed to possess in the perusal of Dr. Madden’s Report, or in the inquiry now before the Committee. Beyond casual shipments in the manner described, and the acceptance of credits opened at our establishments by parties abroad, in behalf of parties resident in that coast, we have not even one single correspondent, or have we even consigned or sold, or in fact transacted any business whatsoever, or had any intercourse with individuals resident in those parts. We possess no interest in the trade with them, and even the agency for buying and shipping, which now and then we have had, is so insignificant, that we look with the most perfect indifference, as may easily be believed by any one who knows any thing of our business, as to any future legislation which may be the result of the present Parliamentary inquiry, or, indeed, as to any construction which may be put upon that now in existence. It is not, therefore, with the view of in any degree influencing the deliberations of the Committee, or of offering any remark on the facts or on the opinions contained in Dr. Madden’s Report, that we address your Lordship. Let the result of the labours of the Committee be what they may, and let the merits or the influence of Dr. Madden’s Report be what it may, whatever legislation may emanate from these proceedings, as a matter of business, it is of no moment to us, and therefore it is not our intention to throw the weight of a feather in the balance. Our sole object is to place our position in its true light; and the simple fact of our possessing no interest whatever, either personal or otherwise, in any branch of trade with the coast of Africa, much less with that lamentable branch of it which, much before the law was carried to even its present extent, our firm has shunned in all its branches and ramifications during an existence in business of more than seventy years, independent of the consideration of its illegality, without partaking in many of the views entertained by others concerning it, but from the principle of not wishing to derive profit or advantage from the sufferings of humanity, whether avoidable or unavoidable.
We have, &c.(signed)Zulueta & Co.
We have, &c.
(signed)Zulueta & Co.
HOUSE OF COMMONS.Select Committee on West Coast of Africa.R. R. Gibbons, Esq. toMessrs. Zulueta & Co.
Gentlemen,July 13th, 1842.
Iam desired by Lord Sandon, the chairman of this committee, to forward to you copies of evidence taken before them, in which your house is mentioned; and I am to acquaint you that if you are desirous of making any statement thereon, either personally or by letter, the committee will be ready to receive the same.
I have, &c.
(signed)R. R. Gibbons.
MEMBERS PRESENT.
Sir T. D. Acland.Mr. Aldam.Lord Viscount Courtenay.Lord Viscount Ebrington.Mr. Evans.Captain Fitzroy.Mr. Forster.Mr. Hamilton.Mr. Metcalf.Mr. Milnes.Mr. W. Patten.Mr. Stuart Wortley.
Sir T. D. Acland.Mr. Aldam.Lord Viscount Courtenay.Lord Viscount Ebrington.Mr. Evans.Captain Fitzroy.
Sir T. D. Acland.Mr. Aldam.Lord Viscount Courtenay.Lord Viscount Ebrington.Mr. Evans.Captain Fitzroy.
Sir T. D. Acland.Mr. Aldam.Lord Viscount Courtenay.Lord Viscount Ebrington.Mr. Evans.Captain Fitzroy.
Mr. Forster.Mr. Hamilton.Mr. Metcalf.Mr. Milnes.Mr. W. Patten.Mr. Stuart Wortley.
Mr. Forster.Mr. Hamilton.Mr. Metcalf.Mr. Milnes.Mr. W. Patten.Mr. Stuart Wortley.
Mr. Forster.Mr. Hamilton.Mr. Metcalf.Mr. Milnes.Mr. W. Patten.Mr. Stuart Wortley.
Lord Viscount Sandonin the chair.
Henry William Macaulay, Esq. called in; and further examined.
5003.Chairman.] Will you state what has been your connexion and acquaintance with the coast of Africa?—I went out to Sierra Leone first in the early part of the year 1830 as a merchant, and at the latter end of the year 1831 I was appointed one of the judges in the court of Mixed Commission; I then left business and devoted myself entirely to the business of the court; and I ceased to act as a judge on the 31st of December, 1839.
5004. Since what time have you been at home?—I remained on the coast a short time to recover my health. I was too unwell to move for some months, and then went to the Island of Ascension, from which I came home in the latter end of the year 1840.
5005. Will you state what the court of mixed commission consists of?—The Portuguese court consists of a British commissary judge and a Portuguese commissary judge, who have to decide upon every Portuguese case; in case of any difference of opinion between thetwo principal judges, the British commissioner of arbitration and the Portuguese commissioner of arbitration draw lots as to which of the two the case is to be referred to for final decision. In the same way, in the Spanish court, the British commissary judge meets the Spanish commissary judge, and in case of difference of opinion, the case is left to either the British or Spanish commissioner of arbitration, as the lot may determine.
5006. Are there any judges for other nations?—The courts at Sierra Leone are the Portuguese court, the Spanish court, the Brazilian court, and the Dutch court; but no court during my time has been perfect in the number of its judges except the Brazilian court.
5007. You mean by perfect, that the British judge has had to sit alone?—The treaties require that after a certain time, in the absence of any foreign judge, the British commissioner of arbitration shall act as the foreign commissary judge.
5008. Who is the British commissioner of arbitration; is he a distinct person from the British commissary judge?—Yes; the British court is always perfect.
5009. What does it consist of?—It consists of the British commissary judge and the British commissioner of arbitration; and the treaties point out how any vacancy, either by death or absence, is to be supplied; the governor in the first instance, attends for the absent judge, whoever he may be, and after him, the chief justice, and then the colonial secretary. It is left to those three officers; but I presume that if those three should all be ill, or their places be vacant by death, the office would then descend to the person next in seniority in the colonial government there; but we never went lower than the colonial secretary. The Brazilian court has been the only one perfect, and the British commissioner of arbitration has always sat in my time for the Portuguese and Spanish commissary judges. No case at all has occurred in the Dutch court.
5010. In case a vessel taken under the colours of any other nation were brought into Sierra Leone, how would that case be decided?—There are other treaties than those I have mentioned. A French case is sent to the French authorities under the French treaty, and in the treaties with all other nations that have treaties on the model of the French treaty, the vessels are handed over to their own judicial authorities.
5011. Within Sierra Leone?—The treaty points out where they are to be taken; if a French vessel is taken, it is sent to Goree.
5012. Then no vessels are brought in for adjudication to Sierra Leone but Dutch and Portuguese, and Spanish and Brazilian vessels?—Not for adjudication by the mixed commission; but there is the vice-admiralty court, which under the late act relating to Portugal, for the suppression of the slave trade, takes cognizance of vessels under that flag which are captured; and may take cognizance of any vessels under any flag that are captured in British waters, wherever they are taken, whether at Sierra Leone, or the Gambia, or any British settlement on the coast, and that has been rather frequent of late.
5013. The mixed commission court has jurisdiction over all cases which are brought within the limits of the treaty with Portugal, and the Vice-Admiralty Court in the Portuguese cases, over which we have assumed jurisdiction by Act of Parliament, that is to say, all cases of vessels captured south of the Line?—Yes; it is optional still for the captor to prosecute a Portuguese vessel, captured under the Act of Parliament, before the admiralty court, if he chooses, instead of bringing her before the mixed commission court, but the process is so much more summary with us, and the expense so much less, that that option is seldom taken.
5014. Will you proceed to explain what is the process which is pursued when a slaver is brought into Sierra Leone for adjudication?—Whenever a vessel appears in the harbour under any of the flags of which we can take cognizance, the marshal of the court goes on board, and he receives from the prizemaster who is on board an account of the capture, which he fills into a printed form, and he sends one of those printed forms to each of the judges, and one to the governor, immediately; in fact, generally before the vessel comes to anchor, and then the court is made aware of the vessel being in the harbour, and is prepared to make arrangements for the landing of the slaves, if there are any, generally the morning after its arrival, if it comes in the evening, or if it comes in early in the morning, the same day. The proctor for the captor brings the papers of the vessel before the court, and they are always accompanied by a declaration of the captor. All the forms of the court are very much the same as those of the Admiralty Court in England. If there are slaves, the proctor petitions for the admission of the vessel into court, and generally accompanies that by a petition to land the slaves; and since I have been there, in every case of inquiry the slaves were landed and handed over to the superintendent of the African department pending the investigation, and held in their character of slaves during the time that the vessel was passing through the court. The proctor then produces his witnesses, and they are examined upon printed interrogatories, which have been used ever since the court was formed. These questions are framed with a view to make out a case, and they always do prove slave dealing wherever it has existed, if the witness answers truly; and in an ordinary case, where slaves are on board, no defence is ever attempted, it is out of the question. Then as soon as the evidence is given, generally by the captain and one of the officers of the captured vessel, the proctor prays for publication; and when the monition which issues in the first instance, calling upon any persons to bring forward a claim if they have any against the capture, or to show cause why the vessel should not be condemned, is returned, trial is prayed for, and it takes place on an early day after arrival of the vessel; in an undefended case, and where the capture has been made properly by the man-of-war, the vessel is condemned, the slaves are emancipated at the same time; a commission of appraisement and sale issues, which directs the particular officer of the court who has the duty of conducting the auctions to expose both the vessel and the goods, and any thing that may be on board, to public auction, after due notice given. Those things are then sold, and theproceeds are divided equally between the British Government and the foreign government, and the proceeds are then paid into the commissariat, which settles with the Government at home, and they pay the money, or set it off against any claim they may have against the foreign government; but the foreign government has a claim to one-half the proceeds of the vessels and cargoes.
5015. Is there any large proportion of cases in which condemnation does not follow, and under what circumstances principally has condemnation not been the consequence?—There have been vessels restored for being seized, for instance, Portuguese vessels from the southward of the Line, contrary to treaty. In two cases there were vessels restored with upwards of 8,000l.damages against the captors in each case, making 16,000l.; and there was again one case of the Pepita, which I remember, when it was proved that the slaves had been embarked under circumstances that would not justify condemnation under the treaty; she was restored with damages. There have been several cases under the equipment article since the new slave treaty came into force, where vessels have been restored because the equipment was not deemed sufficient to warrant condemnation. There have been also vessels taken on the suspicion that black persons on board were slaves, who have been proved to be domestics, and not bought for the purpose of the traffic. There have been a variety of condemnations; but in any case where the treaty would not warrant condemnation, the vessel has been restored; and where the treaty required it, restored with damages.
5016. Have there been a considerable number of restorations; can you state, from statistics, the number?—I have statistics for two years; from the 1st of January to the 31st of December 1838, one vessel only was liberated.
5017. What number were condemned?—Forty-one; during the year 1839 there were two liberated, and 45 condemned; and in addition to those, there was a very large number of American vessels which were seized, with American papers on board, and which I refused to receive into court at all; there were some in 1838, and there was a large number in 1839.
5018. Can you state the number?—I think the number was 13; but the reports of the whole of those cases are in the Parliamentary Papers.
5019. Were theybonâ fideAmerican?—I believe not American, in any one case, but sailing under the American flag, and with American papers, supplied to them by American authority.
5020. Where?—Almost entirely, I think, without one exception, at Havannah.
5021. Supplied by the American consul?—Yes; but I considered that as they sailed with those American papers, however wrongfully they might have been given by the American authority, we had no right to interfere with them.
5022. Mr.Forster.] Have not some vessels belonging to the States been condemned?—Yes; since my time.
5023. You were not a party to the condemnation?—I was not.
5024. Mr.W. Patten.] But in those cases which you mention,you had not the slightest doubt in the world that they would have been condemned if they had not American papers on board?—Certainly they would, with the exception of one case, which seemed to be a sort of experimental seizure: it was known that almost every vessel on the coast under the American flag, at that time was a Spanish vessel in disguise; and this vessel seems to have been seized in the hope that the captain and officers might be able to prove, by some evidence found on board, that she was really Spanish; but though we had access to the papers, we found nothing that would have condemned her if she had been prosecuted in the court; there was a deficiency of papers on board; the captain, perhaps had either destroyed them or concealed them, and we could not get at the proof that would have enabled us to condemn her as being a Spanish vessel; but none of the cases I speak of were prosecuted; I would not allow them to be libelled in court.
5025. So that those cases do not appear upon the records of the court?—No; but I took the opportunity of examining the papers, and sending home all the particulars to the Foreign-office, and the papers are copied in the Parliamentary Returns.
5026. Mr.Forster.] Will those seizures be matter of complaint on the part of the owners?—I do not know that any of those seizures have been matter of complaint; some of the seizures made subsequently have been.
5027. Seizures of vessels belonging to the United States?—Yes; but none of those that came before me have been made matter of complaint.
5028. Are you aware that there are several cases of condemnation that have been the subject of remonstrance with the British Government by the United States?—I believe the whole of them are.
5029.Chairman.] You have not heard that they complain of vessels being brought in for condemnation to Sierra Leone which you did not allow to be libelled in court?—No, except as regards the general right which was exercised. There has been no complaint with respect to a particular vessel, so far as I know; but complaints have been made of the right which was exercised by cruizers on the coast to board any American vessel and search it.
5030. Mr.Aldam.] Has the practice of the court been changed since your time?—Yes, it was changed the day that I left; there was an American vessel waiting at Sierra Leone for adjudication the day I left, and the officer suspecting, that if presented to me, I should refuse her in the same way as I had done the others, detained her till I left, and she was condemned by my successor under orders from Lord Palmerston.
5031. Then the orders from Lord Palmerston changed the practice of the court?—Yes.
5032. Do you know the nature of those orders?—The orders appear in the printed correspondence.
5033. Mr.W. Patten.] Can you state briefly the nature of the orders?—His Lordship stated that the Queen’s advocate was of opinion that the court was justified in making use of information obtained by the search of vessels under the American flag. Thecourt had decided, that having no right to search vessels sailing as American, and recognised as American by American authorities, they could not make use of any information which they obtained by unauthorised and illegal acts, and Lord Palmerston considered that they had a right.
5034.Chairman.] You held that the papers protected the vessel?—I did.
5035. Mr.Forster.] Then it is those condemnations which are appealed against at present by the American government?—I have not seen any appeal of the American government except against the general right exercised by the British cruizers.
5036. The complaint is, of seizing vessels as connected with the slave trade, which, from their papers, ought not to have been subject to that suspicion?—I am not aware of any appeal in any case of that kind.
5037. Mr.Aldam.] Have any vessels with strictly American papers been condemned?—You can hardly call them strictly American papers where the papers have been applied for, and given through fraud. The American authorities at the Havannah who gave them, knew very well that the vessel had no more claim to be styled an American vessel than a Dutch vessel.
5038.Chairman.] But as far as the documents themselves showed, those vessels were American?—Yes, they had an American register, just in the same form as any vessel sailing from New York, or Baltimore; indeed it was a copy of the same document.
5039. What indication was there in other papers taken, to lead you to know that the property was notbonâ fideAmerican?—It appeared, from the very strict overhauling these vessels received from the cruizers, that in many of those cases there were papers on board showing that the man who appeared as the American captain was only a passenger, and that the 30 Spanish passengers who took out passengers’ licences at Havannah were the real crew; and there were also instructions, found on board, to the pretended captain, what he was to answer to the cruizers when they boarded him. The whole thing was a complete fraud without any doubt whatever. There were many of those cases where it was quite plain that the vessels were only Spaniards in disguise; that they only kept the American flag until their cargo was ready. In some cases the vessels that were boarded one day by the cruizers under the American flag, were boarded two or three days afterwards with the Portuguese or Spanish flag hoisted, and full of slaves.
5040. And condemned?—Yes.
5041. What was the object of hoisting the Spanish or Portuguese flag?—If the vessels had been captured by a British cruizer with the American flag hoisted, he would have carried them into America; and if he did carry them into America, every man on board would have been hung as a pirate.
5042. Had he authority to do so?—Itwasdone; the American authorities did not complain of it.
5043. Mr.W. Patten.] Were they hung in that case?—No, there were no slaves on board.
5044. Mr.Aldam.] Every ship of war has a right to capture a pirate?—Yes.
5045. The law of the United States recognizes slavery as piracy?—Yes, but it is not piracy by the law of nations, and indeed our own courts have decided most positively on that point, that the slave trade is not piracy by the law of nations; that it can only be punished by the municipal law of the particular country to which the vessel belongs.
5046. Mr.Forster.] The class of condemnations to which you have alluded are different from the cases which have taken place since you left, under the direction of Lord Palmerston?—No condemnations took place before the 1st of January, 1840; there were vessels condemned by me that were captured under the American flag, and with American papers, but they were taken in British waters, where British ships had a right to visit and search the vessel, and the captor might make use of any information he obtained in the search: when apparent American vessels were boarded on the high seas, we deemed that the captor had not that authority.
5047.Chairman.] What do you consider British waters on the coast of Africa; what would you for instance, on the Gold Coast, consider British waters?—The waters of a nation are those within gun-shot of the shore; generally reckoned three miles; it is the same all over the world.
5048. With regard to the Gold Coast, you are aware that our settlements consist of several forts; do you consider the whole line of coast, from end to end, along which our forts are planted, to be British water?—No, for there are foreign forts there mixed with ours; but in every case we have the sovereignty over three miles of the sea from our own possession, wherever it may be, and the only ports to which a vessel could go, have forts attached to them; a vessel lying at Accra, or lying at Cape Coast, would be within three miles of the fort.
5049. If she was sailing along the coast, should you consider her to be in British waters?—Where an indefinite authority is exercised along a line of coast, without any real right, I do not consider those British waters.
5050. You would consider as British waters only those which were a certain distance from the fort?—Yes; the difficulty occurred in the case of the Jack Wilding, one of the richest prizes that was made during the year 1839; she was seized lying in British Accra roadstead, and she was under the American flag; she was brought up to Sierra Leone, and defended, on the ground that, though the vessel was in British waters, she was within three miles of the Dutch fort, but we considered that that could not make any difference, that we could not allow slave trading within three miles of any acknowledged British fort, and we condemned the vessel.
5051. Have you seen practical evil arise from the mixed commission being fixed at Sierra Leone?—No, certainly not.
5052. Not as to the health of the slaves in the length of the voyage from the place of seizure to the place of condemnation?—I believe that there is a great misapprehension on this subject, whichwould be corrected by a mere reference to the statistics of the trade; there seems to be an impression that a very great majority of the cases of capture are made to the eastward of Cape Palmas, and in the bights, but a large number have been taken for many years past, and might always have been taken, to the westward of Cape Palmas, and in the neighbourhood of Sierra Leone.
5053. Is there any statement of the length of voyage of each vessel from the time of its seizure to the time of its condemnation?—I do not think there is any table drawn out; but in the printed reports the times and places of capture are stated, which comes to the same thing; because, where the vessels are captured in the immediate neighbourhood of Sierra Leone, the voyage is very short, and in going through the reports the number of days can be calculated. In the detailed reports which are given of each case, the date of the capture is always mentioned, and the date of arrival at Sierra Leone. In some cases the vessels are delayed after capture, and you could not get an exact account; but in most cases the difference between the date of capture and the date of arrival would be the length of voyage.
5054. Mr.Forster.] Has not the great bulk of the seizures been made in the bights and to the eastward of Cape Palmas?—Not a very large majority during the last year, and before that a large portion were made to the westward of Cape Palmas; and if that part of the coast had had the number of cruizers that it ought to have had, there would have been a much larger number of captures made there.
5055.Chairman.] You think that the slave trade has gone on with greater intensity to the westward of Cape Palmas?—With great intensity in the Gallinas, which was unnoticed for some years; and, indeed, that part of the coast was utterly neglected. The admiral and commanding officers seemed to fancy that the slave trade could only be carried on in the bights, but a great deal of slave trade was carried on to the westward.
5056. Where?—In Gallinas, principally, New Sesters, Sherboro’; those are the principal ports in that part; there are others smaller.
5057. For all those ports, of course, Sierra Leone you consider to be the most advantageous position?—Certainly.
5058. Mr.Forster.] But in speaking of the amount of slave trade carried on at those places which you have just named, do you speak of those in comparison with the bights, and also with the Spanish and Portuguese settlements to the south of the Line?—I speak of the amount of captures that have been made there. The south was left very nearly in the same state in which the north was. The cruizing of the squadron was almost entirely confined to the bights.
5059. To the south of the Line they could not cruize, could they?—Yes, they could cruize near the Portuguese settlements, for the court practically got over the article in the treaty under which captures were forbidden to the southward of the Line, by establishing, which they did in 1838, the principle, that the national character of any vessel was to be taken from the residence of the owner, the place where he carried on his mercantile business, and also from the courseof trade in which the vessel was engaged; and as there could be no foreign Portuguese slave trade, for Portugal has no colonies to supply with slaves, we were sure to make the vessel either Brazilian or Spanish. She was captured under Portuguese colours, and with Portuguese papers, but the treaty had given us a right to search her any where, either north or south; it had not given us the right to detain her south of the Line, if she wasbonâ fidePortuguese; but if captured as a Portuguese vessel under the Portuguese flag, and with Portuguese papers, she was sent up to Sierra Leone, and was almost certain to be condemned either as a Brazilian or a Spaniard.
5060. That decision was come to in 1838?—Yes.
5061. Before that time the impression had prevailed that the slave trade from the Portuguese settlements was protected?—There was no seizure to the south of the Line to render a decision necessary; vessels were seized immediately close to the Line, in several cases, and it was never thought of; that was before the Portuguese flag was so much used, and the cause of the Portuguese flag being so much used by slavers, was the Spanish treaty having given the right to seize, on the ground of equipment; that did not take place till 1836. I was at home in that year, and on my return in December 1837, I found that almost every vessel on the coast was sailing under Portuguese colours, and then we met this new circumstance by an alteration in the interpretation of the treaty.
5062. Mr.Aldam.] If the owner had been abonâ fidePortuguese, would the vessel have been still condemned?—If the owner had been a Portuguese, resident in Havannah, we should have treated the vessel as a Spanish vessel; and if at Rio Janeiro, we should have treated it as a Brazilian vessel.
5063. But in the case of a Portuguese merchant resident in a Portuguese possession, and carrying on his business there?—We should have looked at the course of trade in which the vessel was engaged, and the Portuguese having no colonies would not require slaves.
5064. Mr.Forster.] Do you consider the Spanish and Portuguese settlements to the south of the Line the places at which the slave trade will be last overcome?—The part of the coast at which the slave trade is carried on depends entirely on the cruizers; you may knock up the slave trade on any part of the coast you please, if the cruizing is properly conducted. The largest slave trade on the coast was the slave trade at the Gallinas; by the system of blockade that Captain Denman adopted there, he completely destroyed it.
5065. That blockade must be continued to make it permanent in its results?—Yes; and he never went away for water or provisions, without leaving a vessel to supply his place. He could always regulate the time that he should remain, knowing of course, to a day, how long his water and provisions would last him.
5066. But to render that remedy effectual and permanent, vessels of war must continue at the Gallinas?—Yes; but if you blockade the rivers, where the slave trade has been carried on for a number of years, and completely shut up the slave trade for a year or two, you destroy the system of slave trade in that part.
5067.Chairman.] You think the machinery cannot be re-established in that part?—It may be re-established, but in the meantime there is no mart for the slaves; they are brought down and lodged in the barracoons, and the feeding of the slaves completely ruins the slave owner.
5068. Mr.Forster.] What is there to prevent the system being resumed there unless you continue the blockade of the place?—There is nothing.
5069. Then it is upon the blockade of the settlements that the success of the cruizers depends, and not upon the destruction of the barracoons?—Exactly; by blockade, I do not mean shutting out legitimate trade, but preventing any vessel fitted for the slave trade going in, and preventing any vessel with slaves coming out.
5070.Chairman.] Do you believe that if you blockade a port, materially interfering with the slave trade for a considerable period, you obstruct it even for some time afterwards?—I think you do; and I think the people are so accustomed to the goods which they procure from slave dealers that they will get them if they can by other means.
5071. Then you think, that if you can blockade for a certain time, and put an end to the power of procuring what the natives desire by the slave trade, that their taste will have to be gratified by lawful traffic, and that that will make it less necessary for them afterwards to have recourse to the slave trade?—Certainly.
5072. Mr.Forster.] By such destruction as took place in the case of Gallinas, do you not interfere with the course of the legitimate trade, as well as with the course of the slave trade?—I am not speaking of the destruction of a settlement.
5073. Had not the operations of Captain Denman the effect of destroying the stores, and in fact the whole settlement?—He destroyed the barracoons; but no one ever kept in barracoons any thing but slaves.
5074. Was not also a considerable property in merchandize destroyed?—Yes, so it appears by the Parliamentary papers. At that time there was no trade whatever carried on at Gallinas except in slaves; there was no legitimate trade at all, I believe.
5075. Do you mean that there was no legitimate trade carried on at the Gallinas previous to the destruction of that place by Captain Denman?—I believe, none whatever; there was certainly none with its nearest large port, which was Sierra Leone; the only trade carried on between the two places was of a very questionable character.
5076. Were not Hamburg vessels and other foreign vessels constantly in the habit of visiting Gallinas for the purpose of legitimate trade previous to the destruction of the settlement?—I am not aware that they did.
5077. I thought you told the Committee in a late answer, that there was no legitimate trade carried on there?—From Sierra Leone; but whether Hamburg vessels went direct to Gallinas, I do not know; from Sierra Leone, I do not believe that any legitimate trade was carried on with the Gallinas.
5078. What opportunities had you at Sierra Leone of knowingthe course of trade to Gallinas?—I was in Sierra Leone, where there were a large number of small coasting vessels employed, and those who brought back produce did not go to Gallinas for it.
5079. But had you any opportunity of knowing the nature and extent of the legitimate trade there by foreign vessels, independently of Sierra Leone?—No; but I have always understood, (it is only from hearsay I mention this,) from the men-of-war on the coast, that every vessel they have found lying in the harbour there, has been engaged in the slave trade in some way or other, as American vessels bringing over goods from the Havannah for the supply of factories, or bringing out equipments to be carried away by slavers when they were full.
5080. You have stated that previously to the destruction of Gallinas by Captain Denman, no trade had been carried on between the Gallinas and Sierra Leone, except such as was of a very questionable nature?—I have.
5081. Was that questionable trade to a considerable extent?—No, not with Sierra Leone; but trading vessels that came along the coast have called at Sierra Leone, and gone down the coast afterwards, and probably put into Gallinas amongst other ports; but directly with Sierra Leone the trade was very little indeed.
5082. Up to what period did this questionable trade between Sierra Leone and Gallinas continue?—It continued as long as I was connected with the colony, that is, to the 31st of December, 1839; but we always looked with suspicion upon any merchant there that was connected with that place.
5083. Is it within your knowledge that up to that time the slave dealers, by themselves, or their agents, were in the habit of frequenting Sierra Leone, and making purchases there for the supply of Gallinas?—They generally made their purchases, I believe, through some merchant resident at Sierra Leone; one in particular; they generally had one merchant at a time, I believe, who was employed by them.
5084.Chairman.] Making purchases of prize goods?—Yes, and sometimes of vessels; a vessel that might be put up to auction there he would bid for, and have it sent down to Gallinas; and I have no doubt goods also.
5085. Was he a white merchant, or a black, who was so employed?—He was a white merchant, an English merchant.
5086. Who was he?—The name is mentioned in the Parliamentary Papers, as being connected with the purchase of a slave vessel, Mr. Kidd; and it is mentioned in connection with that of Mr. Zulueta, of London.
5087. Can you refer to the passage?—It appears at the 38th page of the class (B.) of the papers on the subject of the slave trade, presented to Parliament 1839-40. Zulueta, the gentleman in London to whom the vessel was sent, and who sold her again to her former Spanish owner, is a name well known on the coast in connexion with the slave trade; any man ought to have been careful of being connected with such a person as that. I have seen the same vessels over and over again in the slave trade; you can detect them when you get accustomed to the form and build of the vessels.
5088. Mr.Forster.] Were not those vessels sold to the best bidder?—Yes.
5089. Do not you think that the fault was with those who sold them originally, and not those who bought them?—No; you are not bound to suppose that a man will make a bad use of that which he purchases.
5090. Mr.W. Patten.] Are those vessels generally bought by the same person?—Mr. Kidd purchased vessels only during the latter part of the time I was there, for he was not in the colony when I first went there; he was looked upon as the person employed by the Gallinas slave dealers to transact their business at Sierra Leone.
5091.Chairman.] To purchase vessels and goods?—Yes.
5092. Mr.W. Patten.] Is Mr. Kidd the person you alluded to just now, who generally purchased the vessels at auction?—No, they were generally purchased by various people; he purchased a few of them.
5093. Mr.Forster.] Would Mr. Zulueta, if he had entered the auction-room, have been at liberty to bid for the purchase of that vessel?—Certainly; by the treaty it is required that the goods seized shall be exposed to public auction for the benefit of the two governments.
5094. How do you make it out to be criminal in Mr. Kidd to do that which it was innocent for the auctioneer on the part of the British Government to do?—The auctioneer is required to do it by his duty, he is appointed for that purpose under the Act of Parliament; he sells to any body who will purchase; of course, the responsibility of the employment of the purchase rests with the purchaser.
5095. Then it is the fault of the Government, not of the auctioneer?—It is not the fault of the auctioneer; nor do I consider it any fault of the British Government; it is no fault to purchase goods, but to use them unlawfully is wrong; it is the use which he makes of the vessel after purchasing it that is wrong.
5096. How could it be criminal in Mr. Kidd to sell the vessel to Mr. Zulueta when you see no fault in the British Government doing the same thing?—The British Government is obliged to do it under the treaty; there is no compulsion on Mr. Kidd to sell his vessel to a slave dealer, he may sell it to any body.
5097. According to that doctrine, the British Government is obliged to act criminally?—No, certainly not; I do not think it follows. The treaty requires that goods and vessels shall be exposed at auction; the responsibility of the employment of those goods or vessels which are sold, I think, rests with the purchaser; he may employ them lawfully, and I have purchased a vessel at auction myself, in former days, when I was engaged in business; but if I had taken that vessel and sold her to a slave dealer, I should think that I did wrong.
5098. But you admit that the public auctioneer would have sold the same vessel to the same party whom Mr. Kidd sold her to?—Certainly.
5099.Chairman.] You meant to say that the auctioneer had nochoice to whom he should sell her, and Mr. Kidd had?—The auctioneer had no choice; the Act is imperative, and requires him to sell to the highest bidder, for the benefit of the two governments.
5100. Mr.Aldam.] Did Mr. Kidd sell his vessel to a slave dealer or to a Spanish house, who subsequently sold it to a slave dealer?—It appears in some of the records that in some cases he sold vessels direct to the slave dealers.
5101 Are those vessels worth more to a slave dealer than if used for any other purpose?—Certainly.
5102. How then is it possible to prevent the ships being applied to that purpose for which they are worth more than for any other?—Spanish ships are prevented from being used for the trade by being cut up when they are condemned.
5103. Mr.Evans.] But you have no power of doing so with the Portuguese ships?—No.
5104. Mr.Aldam.] Those vessels, from their small size, are not worth much for other trades?—There are some trades that they are adapted for, the fruit trade for instance, and they are employed in the smuggling of opium and such trades as those; they are not capable of carrying large burdens.
5105. In all cases it will answer the purpose of the merchant to give a larger price for those ships to be employed in the slave trade than for any other purpose?—Yes, probably.
5106. ViscountEbrington.] Have you ever considered what the result would be of the British Government buying those ships in?—It would be impossible to buy them all in.
5107. All that are not liable to be broken up?—No. During last year, for instance, the number condemned was so large, that the Government, if they had bought them, could not have found a use for them.
5108. Mr.Forster.] Have you any doubt that those vessels have been sometimes knocked down by the auctioneer to agents of the slave traders on the coast?—It may have been so, and I have no doubt it has; I do not recollect a case at present, but I would have insisted upon it, as head of the court, that it should have been knocked down to any one who made the highest bid.
5109. It is your opinion also, that the prize goods have been frequently sold in the like manner?—Some portion of them, but certainly not the bulk of them.
5110. Was there any thing to prevent the whole of them being sold to the slave dealers, or the agent of the slave dealers?—Nothing whatever.
5111. Had you opportunities of observing, up to the time you left Sierra Leone, whether the agents of the slave dealers on the neighbouring coast frequently appeared in the market of Sierra Leone as purchasers of goods or vessels?—Not often; if the goods came into their hands it was through a third person generally. I have heard of Spaniards going down, and bidding for the vessels, but it was not an ordinary occurrence.
5112. Then you are of opinion that usually slave dealers at Gallinas did not visit Sierra Leone for the purpose of making purchases ofgoods or vessels?—Not in their own persons, they may have done it through a third party; but, perhaps, it would shorten the questions to state that the greater portion of the goods sold at the auctions captured from vessels in the slave trade were purchased by liberated Africans, by the hawkers there, and they made the best use of them. That a certain portion of the goods so purchased at auctions may get into the hands of slave dealers afterwards, is very possible; but I am convinced, from the description of goods which are sold, which may be used in lawful trade, and from the different appearance of the whole colony since goods were sold so extensively, that the greater portion of them are consumed in the colony, and are made use of in the lawful trade, by liberated Africans in the neighbourhood. I consider that the colony has been very much benefited indeed by those sales; that the condition of the liberated Africans has been very much improved by them, as has been very evident from the great wealth that has been stirring among them; and the liberated Africans have now not only completely bought out the Maroons and settlers, who were the original settlers of the place, but are gradually driving out the white merchants; and I think it a very great advantage, for they are able to live much more cheaply than the white men can do; they carry on their business at one hundredth part of the expense, and turn their money over very much more quickly.
5113. Are any precautions taken by the authorities at Sierra Leone to prevent slave dealers obtaining goods at Sierra Leone, either by public auction or in any other manner?—Certainly not.
5114. Mr.W. Patten.] You have stated that there was an illicit trade going on between Sierra Leone and Gallinas; are there any other circumstances than those you have mentioned, that you can adduce in proof of that?—None; in the trade that has been just referred to, of Spaniards and Portuguese at Gallinas sending up to purchase goods at auctions, they have done so, and they have been sent down to them through a third party, but it is seldom they appear themselves.
5115. You do not, of your own knowledge, know what is the connection between Mr. Kidd and any individuals at Gallinas?—No.
5116. Nor of any other merchant at Sierra Leone?—No.
5117. Do you believe that they act as commission merchants to purchase goods?—Yes; I suppose on commission.
5118. Is there any trade carried on by any merchant on his own account with the Gallinas?—I should think that very likely too; but it is impossible to know, for after vessels have gone outside the Cape they may carry their goods any where: you do not know what becomes of them.
5119. Mr.Forster.] Do you think it would be desirable to impose any restriction upon legitimate trade to Gallinas?—I think not; I think no restriction upon trade should be imposed, even on the intercourse between the two places.
5120. Mr.W. Patten.] How would you distinguish the legitimate from the illegitimate trade?—You cannot distinguish it; and there I think the danger lies of attempting to interfere with intercourse.
5121. Mr.Forster.] And therefore, in attempting to check or impedethe one, you would do more harm than good in repressing and discouraging the other?—I think it very probable; I think it would be quite impossible to draw the line.
5122. But supposing it to be possible, do you think it would be, in fact, desirable to take any measures which would have the effect of checking the progress of legitimate trade?—Certainly not.
5123. Were there any Hamburgh vessels condemned at Sierra Leone?—Not in my time.
5124. Mr.Hamilton.] Do you think that the establishing such a blockade on the coast as you have alluded to just now, would have the effect of interfering with legitimate trade?—No, not such a blockade as I alluded to; I think the natives are well aware of the design for which the cruizers are on the coast, they would consider their presence rather as a protection, than otherwise, to the legitimate trade.
5125. Mr.Forster.] Were not large quantities of tobacco and rum sold at Sierra Leone from the prize vessels conveyed there leeward for sale to the Sierra Leone merchants?—Yes; I believe there were several cargoes of Brazilian tobacco and of spirits sent down the coast: I believe, principally to Badagry and that neighbourhood.
5126. That tobacco was, of course, especially imported on the coast for the purpose of the slave trade?—It was taken out of slave vessels; therefore, of course, it was.
5127. When it arrived at Badagry, it would consequently be very acceptable to slave dealers there?—Yes; but they had to pay for it.
5128. Mr.W. Patten.] Did you find when you were at Sierra Leone that the price paid for goods at auctions exceeded or was below the price of goods imported in other ways?—The necessary effect of such large quantities of goods being thrown on the market, and compelled to be sold at any rate to the highest bidder, was of course to lower the price; and I consider that the very cheap rate at which the liberated Africans were able to procure those goods, which, in former times, they could only obtain at a high price, was what formed the advantage which they derived from those sales.
5129. How do you account for it, that the merchants at Sierra Leone do not themselves purchase those goods?—They have not the money; in fact, they have no money at all. There are only one or two men that have any money in the place; they are almost all men who receive their goods from houses in England; they are generally very much in debt to the persons who send goods to them; and the only parties who have money in the colony, with the exception of two gentlemen, are liberated Africans, and many of the latter have very large sums.
5130. Mr.Forster.] Has the trade at Sierra Leone not, in your opinion, been a successful trade for some years?—It has been a successful trade for the liberated Africans.
5131. The question applied to British traders?—I cannot say; I have not been engaged in trade myself during that time; but I should think that the English traders must have suffered by the goods which were thrown on the market from slave vessels, whilst theyhad goods which were purchased at a much dearer rate to dispose of, and had not the money to purchase the low-priced goods there. But one case I can mention, where a white merchant at Sierra Leone had the funds to go into the market and compete with the liberated Africans; he has made a great deal of money by it, and the more in consequence of his means being so superior to those of the Africans; but that was because he had money: the losses of the others were because they had none.
5132. You have spoken of the advantages to the black population from the sale of those goods, which have led them to become hawkers and pedlars in the neighbouring country; it is the fact that the natives of Africa are very much disposed to that species of employment in preference to agricultural labour?—It certainly is so at Sierra Leone.
5133. Then the advantages derived from the encouragement thus given to them to embark in that species of employment in preference to the fixed pursuits of agriculture may be questionable on that ground?—I think not; I think if the liberated African can get money and can educate his family well, and procure all that he wants by trade, it is just as well as if he procured it by agriculture.
5134. Have you found them practically carrying on any regular system of agriculture voluntarily?—Not for export: there have been some articles cultivated, but to no very great extent: ginger, and pepper, and cassada, but cultivation has not been carried to any great extent for export at Sierra Leone.
5135. How do you account for cultivation and improvement having made so little progress in Sierra Leone after all the efforts of the party in this country, and all the money which has been expended upon it?—I doubt the proposition contained in the question; I think that they have made progress.
5136. Planting and cultivation is carried on there to a great extent?—No, it is not; but the people have other means of procuring what they require.
5137. Have any means been taken, or if taken, have they been successful, for promoting any regular system of agriculture or planting in the neighbourhood of Sierra Leone?—No, I think not, and I am very sorry for it; I think more might have been done in the way of premiums upon produce, and giving prizes for successful cultivation.
5138. In fact, has any thing been done in that way?—Nothing whatever, I believe, of late years. There was an agricultural society that existed many years before I went to the colony, which offered premiums, but the members of it died, and the scheme fell to the ground.
5139. The attempts of that society, in fact, were not successful?—No; it was before my time; I cannot speak positively to the efforts that were made; it is a great many years ago now.
5140. Can you distinguish the amount of captures to the south and north of the Line?—Yes; in 1838, 15 out of 30 vessels, either were captured, or took on board their slaves to the westward of Cape Palmas, or one-third of the vessels which were detained with full cargoesof slaves on board, or four out of seven, if we only look to the vessels detained in the West Indies. The whole, or very nearly, of the slave trade carried on in the north, or rather west of Cape Palmas, is for the supply of the island of Cuba, and generally on account of the Havannah merchants. In the following year, “of the 61 vessels which passed through the courts during the year 1839, three were captured in the West Indies, the remainder on this coast, eight to the southward of the Line, but none below the latitude of 4 deg. 58 min. south, and of 50 vessels captured north of the Line, 30 were met with to the eastward and 20 to the westward of Cape Palmas.â€
5141. Mr.W. Patten.] Does not the return distinguish from what part of the coast those vessels came?—Yes; it goes into all the particulars of the places from which they came, and the places to which they went, and to which they took their cargoes; 18 of the whole number had slaves on board, 11 having shipped their slaves in parts to the eastward of Cape Palmas, and seven to the westward of the same point, and the river where they shipped them is mentioned.
5142. Mr.Forster.] Supposing that the time should arrive when the greatest number of prize vessels should be brought from the southward, would you in that case consider Sierra Leone to be the place best adapted for the mixed commission?—If that arose from the slave trade being permanently at an end in the north, I should say, that the commission should certainly follow the course of the slave trade.
5143. Mr.W. Patten.] From the position you held, had you any information, officially or otherwise, of knowing the state of the slave trade to the south of the Line?—No, except what I got from papers found on board detained vessels, and from conversation with naval officers.
5144. From information so obtained, were you led to believe that the slave trade on the coast of Africa, taking both the east and west coast, had increased or decreased during the period you were there?—It had decreased in the bights, so as to be almost entirely destroyed at one time.
5145. The question refers to the coast on the south of the Line?—When it was suppressed to a great extent in the bights, it was driven both north and south of the bights; the old slave trade rivers in the bights were the principal places frequented by slave vessels, but the whole efforts of the cruizers were directed to that point, and the trade was almost entirely suppressed in those rivers, the Bonny and many others.
5146. You had no information which could enable you to judge whether the slave trade on the whole had increased or decreased during your residence at Sierra Leone?—I should say, that it decreased during the last two years I was there, from the immense number of captures that were made.