Yeas.—Willis Alston, jun., Nathaniel Alexander, George Michael Bedinger, Silas Betton, William Blackledge, Walter Bowie, John Boyle, William Butler, John Campbell, Levi Casey, Thomas Claiborne, Joseph Clay, Jacob Crowninshield, Richard Cutts, Samuel W. Dana, John Davenport, John Dawson, William Dickson, Thomas Dwight, John B. Earle, Peter Early, James Elliot, William Eustis, John Fowler, Edwin Gray, Andrew Gregg, Roger Griswold, Samuel Hammond, Wade Hampton, Seth Hastings, Joseph Heister, James Holland, Benjamin Huger, Michael Leib, Thomas Lowndes, Matthew Lyon, Andrew McCord, David Meriwether, Thomas Moore, Joseph H. Nicholson, Thomas Plater, John Randolph, John Rhea of Tennessee, Thomas Sanford, Tompson J. Skinner, John Cotton Smith, James Stephenson, Samuel Tenney, Samuel Thatcher, Killian K. Van Rensselaer, Daniel C. Verplanck, Lemuel Williams, Richard Wynn, and Thomas Wynns.Nays.—Isaac Anderson, John Archer, Simeon Baldwin, David Bard, Adam Boyd, Robert Brown, Joseph Bryan, William Chamberlin, Clifton Claggett, Matthew Clay, Frederick Conrad, Ebenezer Elmer, John W. Eppes, William Findlay, James Gillespie, Peterson Goodwyn, Gaylord Griswold, John A. Hanna, William Helms, William Hoge, David Holmes, David Hough, John G. Jackson, Walter Jones, William Kennedy, Nehemiah Knight, Joseph Lewis, jr., Henry W. Livingston, John B. C. Lucas, William McCreery, Samuel L. Mitchill, Nicholas R. Moore, Jeremiah Morrow, Anthony New, Thomas Newton, jr., Gideon Olin, Beriah Palmer, Thomas M. Randolph, Jacob Richards, Cæsar A. Rodney, Erastus Root, Thomas Sammons, Ebenezer Seaver, James Sloan, John Smilie, John Smith of New York, John Smith of Virginia, Henry Southard, Richard Stanford, Joseph Stanton, John Stewart, Samuel Taggart, Philip R. Thompson, Abram Trigg, John Trigg, Philip Van Cortlandt, Isaac Van Hornee, Joseph B. Varnum, Peleg Wadsworth, Matthew Walton, Marmaduke Williams, and Joseph Winston.
Yeas.—Willis Alston, jun., Nathaniel Alexander, George Michael Bedinger, Silas Betton, William Blackledge, Walter Bowie, John Boyle, William Butler, John Campbell, Levi Casey, Thomas Claiborne, Joseph Clay, Jacob Crowninshield, Richard Cutts, Samuel W. Dana, John Davenport, John Dawson, William Dickson, Thomas Dwight, John B. Earle, Peter Early, James Elliot, William Eustis, John Fowler, Edwin Gray, Andrew Gregg, Roger Griswold, Samuel Hammond, Wade Hampton, Seth Hastings, Joseph Heister, James Holland, Benjamin Huger, Michael Leib, Thomas Lowndes, Matthew Lyon, Andrew McCord, David Meriwether, Thomas Moore, Joseph H. Nicholson, Thomas Plater, John Randolph, John Rhea of Tennessee, Thomas Sanford, Tompson J. Skinner, John Cotton Smith, James Stephenson, Samuel Tenney, Samuel Thatcher, Killian K. Van Rensselaer, Daniel C. Verplanck, Lemuel Williams, Richard Wynn, and Thomas Wynns.
Nays.—Isaac Anderson, John Archer, Simeon Baldwin, David Bard, Adam Boyd, Robert Brown, Joseph Bryan, William Chamberlin, Clifton Claggett, Matthew Clay, Frederick Conrad, Ebenezer Elmer, John W. Eppes, William Findlay, James Gillespie, Peterson Goodwyn, Gaylord Griswold, John A. Hanna, William Helms, William Hoge, David Holmes, David Hough, John G. Jackson, Walter Jones, William Kennedy, Nehemiah Knight, Joseph Lewis, jr., Henry W. Livingston, John B. C. Lucas, William McCreery, Samuel L. Mitchill, Nicholas R. Moore, Jeremiah Morrow, Anthony New, Thomas Newton, jr., Gideon Olin, Beriah Palmer, Thomas M. Randolph, Jacob Richards, Cæsar A. Rodney, Erastus Root, Thomas Sammons, Ebenezer Seaver, James Sloan, John Smilie, John Smith of New York, John Smith of Virginia, Henry Southard, Richard Stanford, Joseph Stanton, John Stewart, Samuel Taggart, Philip R. Thompson, Abram Trigg, John Trigg, Philip Van Cortlandt, Isaac Van Hornee, Joseph B. Varnum, Peleg Wadsworth, Matthew Walton, Marmaduke Williams, and Joseph Winston.
And then the main question being taken that the House do agree to the said resolution, as amended to read as follows:
Resolved, That a tax of ten dollars be imposed on every slave imported into any part of the United States:
Resolved, That a tax of ten dollars be imposed on every slave imported into any part of the United States:
It was resolved in the affirmative—yeas 71.
Ordered, That a bill or bills be brought in, pursuant to the said resolution; and that theCommittee of Ways and Means do prepare and bring in the same.
The House resumed the consideration of the unfinished business of yesterday, viz: “What day should be made the order to the Committee of the Whole to consider the bill laying a tax of ten dollars upon every slave imported into the United States.”
Mr.Lowndesmoved that the further consideration of the bill should be postponed till the first Monday in December.
Mr.Lowndes.—In moving a postponement of the bill to the first Monday in December next, my object is to get rid of it altogether. Gentlemen have supported the resolution upon which this bill is founded, upon such a variety of, and contradictory grounds, that their arguments are not very susceptible of a reply. I am, however, very glad that it has been conceded by every gentleman who has spoken upon the subject, that this tax, if laid, would not have the effect of diminishing the number of Africans imported into the country. When it was admitted that the object for which the resolution was avowedly brought forward, would not be obtained, I did hope that the resolution itself would not have been persevered in. The gentleman from Pennsylvania, (Mr.Gregg,) to whose arguments I generally listen with pleasure, has told us that he would not for the world give his vote for this tax, for the purpose of raising revenue; but that he would be obliged to vote for the resolution, to show his disapprobation of the trade. The gentleman did, however, manifest a disposition to get rid of the question, without taking a direct vote upon it. Another gentleman from Pennsylvania (Mr.Smilie) has told us, that he too is averse to this tax with a view to revenue, but that he must vote for it, for if he does not, it will be an admission, on his part, that Congress is favorable to the trade. What am I to infer from this observation? Am I to infer that Congress until this time has been favorable to the trade; and am I to infer that the gentleman himself, who has for so long a time been an active member of Congress, has also been favorable to it? This trade has from the adoption of the constitution until a few years ago, when it was first prohibited by Georgia, been carried on; and yet Congress have never exercised their power of imposing any tax, nor have I heard that the gentleman did ever bring forward a resolution for the purpose. There is another description of persons imported into the United States—I mean those bound to serve for a term of years. The comparison I admit is not analogous throughout, but it is to a certain extent. These persons are chiefly introduced into the States of Pennsylvania and New York; none, or at least very few of them, into New England. Were it proposed to embrace them by this tax, would the Representatives from those States be satisfied with the arguments that it was a tax upon merchandise, and a general one, and therefore fair? Their discernment would quickly point out to them, that whatever was the appearance, it was a tax principally falling upon those States, and they would resist.
Entertaining the opinions which I have expressed against the principle of the bill, and wishing to get rid of it in a manner most agreeable to those gentlemen who feel a difficulty of voting directly upon it, I move that the further consideration of the bill be postponed until December next.
Mr.Bedingersaid he felt the greatest veneration for the honorable mover of the resolution, as he thought it proceeded from the purest motives. But as he thought the slave trade was but little better than murder, he felt a difficulty in his mind as to the propriety of admitting one shilling of it into the treasury of the United States, lest those traders should think themselves entitled to protection; but as the mover and many others declare their assent towards the appropriation of said tax hereafter to humane purposes, he believed he should vote for a bill, if drawn in correspondence with such principles.
Mr.Findlayobserved that it was not his wish to go into a lengthy argument on this subject; but merely to observe that this was the first instance of a law prohibiting the importation of slaves being repealed, and that it might not be the last; and that, therefore, if the argument advanced by gentlemen was good against taking it up in the first instance, it would be equally good against taking it up in case all the States should repeal their prohibitory laws. He also wished gentlemen to consider that the friends of the motion were conscience-bound as well as they, and that they considered it a moral duty to restrain, as far as they could, the continuance of the slave trade. As, however, a question of expediency was involved in this measure, he entertained no desire to hasten its decision; on the contrary, his wish was to allow ample time for considering its merits. He should therefore vote against the postponement to December; but would move a postponement to the 2d Monday of March, not with the view of getting rid of the subject altogether, but to allow an opportunity of considering it fully.
Mr.Hugerdid not rise with the view of going into the merits of the bill, but to impress the propriety of agreeing to the postponement. It was a painful subject, which necessarily excited unpleasant feelings. He thought, if gentlemen suffered it to lie over to the next session, there was a probability that by giving the Representatives of South Carolina an opportunity of returning home and expressing the sentiments of Congress, the Legislature of that State would repeal the law; whereas, should the tax be laid, it would prevent this desirable effect. Where we differ, said Mr. H., it is proper for us to accommodate—to meet each other half way.
Mr.Eppes, believing that either motion of postponement would defeat the main measure, said he should vote against both. It was not his wish to erect the Government of the United States into a national tribunal to censure the proceedings of the Legislature of South Carolina, or to wound their feelings; but he was not prepared to say that Congress, in exercising a constitutional right, erected such a tribunal. It was in some respects immaterial whether they interfered or not, so long as the world knew that a Legislature of a respectable State, in the eighteenth century, passed an act allowing the importation of slaves. That Legislature ought not to complain if the United States availed themselves of the measure to raise revenue from it. According to the estimate of some gentlemen, there would probably be an importation of one hundred thousand in four years, which if this tax shall be laid, will produce a revenue of a million of dollars. And yet we are entreated by the gentleman from South Carolina not to molest the trade. Mr. E. said he was not surprised at this anxiety, as, by gaining a delay of one year, that State might be saved from the payment of above one hundred thousand dollars.
Mr. E. said he came from a Southern country, where slaves were as much a subject of taxation as lands; and he did not know that the statute books of Virginia or South Carolina were stained by imposing taxes upon them. He believed them as fair a subject of taxation as any other species of property. He believed it as fair to lay taxes upon them as to make the poor pay a tax upon brown sugar and other articles of the first necessity. For these reasons he was against the postponement either to December or March.
Mr. R.Griswoldconsidered a postponement till December as destructive to the bill. He said he would as soon meet it on its merits, but being prepared, as far as his vote went, to reject the bill, he should vote for what he considered equivalent, a postponement to December. He did not think it proper for the House to go into the measure contemplated by the bill. There were but two principles that would justify the laying a duty on imported articles: the one to discourage the importation of particular articles, and the other with a view to revenue. As to the first principle, under the constitution as it at present stood, Congress had no right to interfere; as the States had an undoubted right to admit the importation of slaves until the year 1808. The constitution, on this point, had gone so far as to restrict the right of the General Government to a tax not exceeding ten dollars upon each slave imported. This would not amount to a prohibition or prevention of the importation. Congress was, therefore, precluded the right of taxing, with this view, until the year 1808. This part of the argument, on which gentlemen support the measure, must be laid, therefore, out of view. The question then recurs, whether we shall lay this tax for purposes of revenue? For one, (said Mr. G.,) I am unwilling to do this. I abhor the slave trade as much as any member on this floor, and therefore I will not consent to give it a legislative sanction. For this measure will certainly be viewed in that light by the people of this country and by the civilized world. It will appear to the world that Congress are raising a revenue from a commerce in slaves. I am not for introducing such a law, calculated to have this impression, on our statute book. Were it in our power to prohibit the trade, there is not, I trust, a member on this floor that would not unite in the prohibition. But on this point our hands are tied.
Mr.Greggobserved, that when this subject was on a former day before the House, he assigned his reasons at some length, in favor of a postponement. The same reasons would influence his vote this day, and he should not trouble the House with a repetition of them. He only rose to suggest to his colleague that, by attending to one consideration, he would be induced, he thought, to change his opinion, and to vote for the most distant day to which it was proposed to postpone this subject. It had been stated by a gentleman from South Carolina, and he believed correctly stated, that by the law lately passed in South Carolina, a considerable ferment had been excited in that State, and that it was probable that the Legislature would, at their next session, repeal it. If it were probable that they would repeal this law in April, it appeared to him improper to pass an act that would operate as a censure upon the conduct of that State.
Mr.Alstonwas surprised how it was that he and his worthy friend from Virginia (Mr.Eppes) differed so widely upon the present occasion, living, as it were, in the same country, and owning property of the same kind, and pursuing the same means of obtaining a living. My friend advocates the resolution for laying a tax of ten dollars on each slave imported into the United States, because a considerable revenue will be derived from such a tax; it is for that very reason that he opposed it, because he would not consent to pass a law which had for its operation a partial effect. Can it be right to pass a law which will impose a heavy tax upon one part of the community, and not a cent upon the other? No State in the Union would be affected except South Carolina. Gentlemen ought to take care how they acted towards a sister State, and a respectable one too.
Mr.Rodneysaid, he should not have troubled the House with any remarks on the present occasion, had he not made up his mind to vote differently from the vote which he had before given. He said he had before voted against the postponement of the consideration of this subject; he should now vote in favor of a postponement; and he would, in a few words, assign his reasons. When the resolution for imposing a tax on imported slaves was first laid on the table, he was of opinion that he couldnot vote for it without sanctioning the practice it was meant to censure. Reflecting further, he afterwards got his own consent to vote for it. First thoughts were frequently best; we sometimes miss the mark by taking sight too long. In this instance, after a more mature consideration, his mind inclined to his original opinions, for reasons which he would assign.
It was agreed, on all hands, that the conduct of the Legislature of South Carolina was such as to merit the disapprobation of the members of that House. On many occasions there were political dissensions within these walls. But he rejoiced that, when questions of this kind presented themselves, they were sure to find us unanimous. Inhumanity was considered as a common enemy, and so inhuman a practice was justly reprobated by all. Every gentleman from the South, as well as the East, deprecated the act and lamented its existence.
After a few additional remarks from several gentlemen, the question was taken by yeas and nays on a postponement to the first Monday in December, and passed in the negative—yeas 55, nays 62.
Mr.Findlaymoved a postponement to the second Monday in March; which, after some debate, prevailed—ayes 56, noes 50.
[To prevent an erroneous impression being made on the public by the above proceedings, it is proper to remark that, during the whole discussion, not a single voice was raised in defence of the act of the Legislature of South Carolina, allowing the importation of slaves; but that, on the contrary, while by some of the speakers its immorality and impolicy were severely censured, by all its existence was deprecated. A large number of those who voted for the postponement, advocated it on the express and sole ground that it would give the Legislature of South Carolina an opportunity, which they believed would be embraced, to repeal the act.]
Mr.J. Randolphsaid, the House would recollect that he had, on a former day, offered a resolution barring any claims derived under any act of the State of Georgia passed in the year 1795, in relation to lands ceded to the United States. It was not his purpose in rising at this time to trespass on the patience of the House; nor did he know that he should in future offer any remarks additional to those he had already made. But he conceived it his duty to place the subject in such a point of light that every eye, however dim, might distinctly see its true merits. For this purpose he withdrew the resolution which he had before offered, and moved the following resolutions:
Resolved, That the Legislature of the State of Georgia were, at no time, invested with the power of alienating the right of soil possessed by the good people of that State in and to the vacant territory of the same, but in a rightful manner, and for the public good:That, when the governors of any people shall have betrayed the confidence reposed in them, and shall have exercised that authority with which they have been clothed for the general welfare, to promote their own private ends, under the basest motives, and to the public detriment, it is the inalienable right of a people, so circumstanced, to revoke the authority thus abused, to resume the rights thus attempted to be bartered, and to abrogate the act thus endeavoring to betray them:That it is in evidence to this House, that the act of the Legislature of Georgia, passed on the seventh of January, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five, entitled “An act for appropriating a part of the unlocated territory of this State, for the payment of the late State troops, and for other purposes,” was passed by persons under the influence of gross and palpable corruption, practised by the grantees of the lands attempted to be alienated by the aforesaid act, tending to enrich and aggrandize, to a degree almost incalculable, a few individuals, and ruinous to the public interest:That the good people of Georgia, impressed with general indignation at this act of atrocious perfidy and unparalleled corruption, with a promptitude of decision highly honorable to their character, did, by the act of a subsequent Legislature, passed on the thirteenth of February, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-six, under circumstances of peculiar solemnity, and finally sanctioned by the people, who have subsequently ingrafted it on their constitution, declare the preceding act, and the grants made under it, in themselves null and void; that the said act should be expunged from the records of the State, and publicly burnt; which was accordingly done; provision at the same time being made for restoring the pretended purchase-money to the grantees, by whom, or by persons claiming under them, the greater part of the said purchase-money has been withdrawn from the treasury of Georgia:That a subsequent Legislature of an individual State has an undoubted right to repeal any act of a preceding Legislature, provided such repeal be not forbidden by the constitution of such State, or of the United States:That the aforesaid act of the State of Georgia, passed on the thirteenth of February, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-six, was forbidden neither by the constitution of that State, nor by that of the United States:That the claims of persons derived under the aforesaid act of the seventh of January, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five, are recognized neither by any compact between the United States and the State of Georgia, nor by any act of the Federal Government: Therefore,Resolved, That no part of the five millions of acres reserved for satisfying and quieting claims to the lands ceded by the State of Georgia to the United States, and appropriated by the act of Congress passed at their last session, shall be appropriated to quiet or compensate any claims derived under any act, or pretended act, of the State of Georgia, passed, or alleged to be passed, during the year one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five.
Resolved, That the Legislature of the State of Georgia were, at no time, invested with the power of alienating the right of soil possessed by the good people of that State in and to the vacant territory of the same, but in a rightful manner, and for the public good:
That, when the governors of any people shall have betrayed the confidence reposed in them, and shall have exercised that authority with which they have been clothed for the general welfare, to promote their own private ends, under the basest motives, and to the public detriment, it is the inalienable right of a people, so circumstanced, to revoke the authority thus abused, to resume the rights thus attempted to be bartered, and to abrogate the act thus endeavoring to betray them:
That it is in evidence to this House, that the act of the Legislature of Georgia, passed on the seventh of January, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five, entitled “An act for appropriating a part of the unlocated territory of this State, for the payment of the late State troops, and for other purposes,” was passed by persons under the influence of gross and palpable corruption, practised by the grantees of the lands attempted to be alienated by the aforesaid act, tending to enrich and aggrandize, to a degree almost incalculable, a few individuals, and ruinous to the public interest:
That the good people of Georgia, impressed with general indignation at this act of atrocious perfidy and unparalleled corruption, with a promptitude of decision highly honorable to their character, did, by the act of a subsequent Legislature, passed on the thirteenth of February, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-six, under circumstances of peculiar solemnity, and finally sanctioned by the people, who have subsequently ingrafted it on their constitution, declare the preceding act, and the grants made under it, in themselves null and void; that the said act should be expunged from the records of the State, and publicly burnt; which was accordingly done; provision at the same time being made for restoring the pretended purchase-money to the grantees, by whom, or by persons claiming under them, the greater part of the said purchase-money has been withdrawn from the treasury of Georgia:
That a subsequent Legislature of an individual State has an undoubted right to repeal any act of a preceding Legislature, provided such repeal be not forbidden by the constitution of such State, or of the United States:
That the aforesaid act of the State of Georgia, passed on the thirteenth of February, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-six, was forbidden neither by the constitution of that State, nor by that of the United States:
That the claims of persons derived under the aforesaid act of the seventh of January, one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five, are recognized neither by any compact between the United States and the State of Georgia, nor by any act of the Federal Government: Therefore,
Resolved, That no part of the five millions of acres reserved for satisfying and quieting claims to the lands ceded by the State of Georgia to the United States, and appropriated by the act of Congress passed at their last session, shall be appropriated to quiet or compensate any claims derived under any act, or pretended act, of the State of Georgia, passed, or alleged to be passed, during the year one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five.
On considering the resolutions, the House divided—ayes 53. Carried.
Mr.J. Randolphthen moved their reference to the Committee of the Whole on the bill providing for the settlement of sundry claims to public lands lying south of the State of Tennessee. Carried—yeas 50, nays 30.
The House went into Committee of the Whole on the bill supplementary to an act providing for a Naval Peace Establishment.
[This is the bill introduced at the instance of Mr.Nicholson, with a view to a more economical and beneficial arrangement in relation to the national ships laid up in ordinary.]
Mr.Leibmoved an additional section, virtually abolishing the office of Lieutenant Colonel Commandant of the Marine Corps, and authorizing the President to make such other reductions of the subordinate officers as he may think fit. The object of the bill being a reform of the expenses attending the Naval Establishment, the measure contemplated in the amendment was, in his opinion, a very proper one to be answered by it. The bill, he said, contemplated an annual saving, in the single article of provisions, of $7,000. By abolishing the office of Lieutenant Colonel Commandant, a saving of sixty thousand dollars in addition might be made. This officer made, it appeared, all the contracts, and it would be seen by documents before the House, that while the price of the ration in the War Department was fifteen cents, that fixed by this officer was twenty cents—the difference made the sum of $3,750 a year. It would also be seen that exorbitant sums were expended in postage and fuel. In the single article of postage, $150 had been expended within three months. The amendment was then agreed to—yeas 62.
Mr.Eustismoved a new section, for the allowance to captains, holding themselves in readiness to enter the service, of the same rations they are entitled by law to receive when in actual service. Disagreed to—yeas 37, nays 45.
The committee rose, and the House agreed to the amendment of Mr.Leibwithout a division.
Mr.Jacksonmoved a new section, for the allowance to captains, required to hold themselves in readiness for service, of the same rations they are entitled to receive when in actual service.
Mr.Nicholsonsupported the amendment, to which the House agreed—yeas 44, nays 40; when the bill was ordered to a third reading to-morrow.
On motion, the House adjourned.
Mr.Findlay, from the Committee of Elections, to whom was referred a memorial of Andrew Moore, of Virginia, respecting the election ofThomas Lewis, a sitting member, made a report, which, after stating the bad votes given for each of the candidates, concludes with the opinion thatThomas Lewisis not, and thatAndrew Mooreis entitled to a seat in the House. The report is as follows:
“That, at an election held on three several days, in the month of April, in the year one thousand eight hundred and three, directed by the law of the State of Virginia, for a member of the House of Representatives of the United States for the district composed of the counties of Botetourt, Rockbridge, Kenawha, Greenbriar, and Monroe, in the western district of Virginia, it appears—“That, of the polls taken in the county of Botetourt, Thomas Lewis had one hundred and fifty-five votes, and Andrew Moore had three hundred and five votes; that, out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis, twenty-three were unqualified to vote; and that out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, twenty-eight were unqualified to vote.“That, of the polls taken in Rockbridge, Thomas Lewis had sixty-five votes, and Andrew Moore had three hundred and twenty-one votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis, there were four persons unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, there were twenty persons unqualified to vote.“That, of the polls taken in Kenawha county, Thomas Lewis had one hundred and sixty-one votes, and Andrew Moore had one vote; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis there were ninety persons unqualified to vote.“That, of the polls taken in Greenbriar, Thomas Lewis had five hundred and thirty-nine votes, and Andrew Moore had one hundred and three votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis two hundred and two were unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore thirty-two were unqualified to vote.“That, of the polls taken in Monroe county, Thomas Lewis had eighty-four votes, and Andrew Moore had one hundred and two votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis thirty-six were unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, forty-four were unqualified to vote. Hence it appears—“That all the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis in the several counties aforesaid, which compose the western district of the State of Virginia, were one thousand and four; and that all the persons who voted for Andrew Moore in the said counties were eight hundred and thirty-two.“It further appears, on a deliberate scrutiny, that, of the above votes, three hundred and fifty-five persons voted for Thomas Lewis who were unqualified to vote, and that one hundred and twenty-four voted for Andrew Moore who were unqualified to vote; and that, by deducting the unqualified votes from the votes given for each of the parties at the elections, Thomas Lewis has six hundred and forty-nine good votes, and Andrew Moore has seven hundred and eight good votes, being fifty-nine more than Thomas Lewis. Whereupon,“Your committee are of opinion that Thomas Lewis, not being duly elected, is not entitled to a seat in this House; and they are further of opinion that Andrew Moore, who has the highest number of votes, after deducting the before-mentioned unqualified votes from the respective polls, is duly elected and entitled to a seat in this House.”
“That, at an election held on three several days, in the month of April, in the year one thousand eight hundred and three, directed by the law of the State of Virginia, for a member of the House of Representatives of the United States for the district composed of the counties of Botetourt, Rockbridge, Kenawha, Greenbriar, and Monroe, in the western district of Virginia, it appears—
“That, of the polls taken in the county of Botetourt, Thomas Lewis had one hundred and fifty-five votes, and Andrew Moore had three hundred and five votes; that, out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis, twenty-three were unqualified to vote; and that out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, twenty-eight were unqualified to vote.
“That, of the polls taken in Rockbridge, Thomas Lewis had sixty-five votes, and Andrew Moore had three hundred and twenty-one votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis, there were four persons unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, there were twenty persons unqualified to vote.
“That, of the polls taken in Kenawha county, Thomas Lewis had one hundred and sixty-one votes, and Andrew Moore had one vote; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis there were ninety persons unqualified to vote.
“That, of the polls taken in Greenbriar, Thomas Lewis had five hundred and thirty-nine votes, and Andrew Moore had one hundred and three votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis two hundred and two were unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore thirty-two were unqualified to vote.
“That, of the polls taken in Monroe county, Thomas Lewis had eighty-four votes, and Andrew Moore had one hundred and two votes; that out of the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis thirty-six were unqualified to vote; and out of the persons who voted for Andrew Moore, forty-four were unqualified to vote. Hence it appears—
“That all the persons who voted for Thomas Lewis in the several counties aforesaid, which compose the western district of the State of Virginia, were one thousand and four; and that all the persons who voted for Andrew Moore in the said counties were eight hundred and thirty-two.
“It further appears, on a deliberate scrutiny, that, of the above votes, three hundred and fifty-five persons voted for Thomas Lewis who were unqualified to vote, and that one hundred and twenty-four voted for Andrew Moore who were unqualified to vote; and that, by deducting the unqualified votes from the votes given for each of the parties at the elections, Thomas Lewis has six hundred and forty-nine good votes, and Andrew Moore has seven hundred and eight good votes, being fifty-nine more than Thomas Lewis. Whereupon,
“Your committee are of opinion that Thomas Lewis, not being duly elected, is not entitled to a seat in this House; and they are further of opinion that Andrew Moore, who has the highest number of votes, after deducting the before-mentioned unqualified votes from the respective polls, is duly elected and entitled to a seat in this House.”
Ordered, That the report be committed to a Committee of the whole House on Wednesday next.
The House resolved itself into a Committee of the Whole on the bill sent from the Senate, entitled “An act erecting Louisiana into two Territories, and providing for the temporary government thereof.”
The fourth section being under consideration, as follows:
“Sec. 4.The Legislative powers shall be vested in the Governor, and in thirteen of the most fit and discreet persons of the Territory, to be called the Legislative Council, who shall be appointed annually by the President of the United States, from among those holding real estate therein, and who shall have resided one year at least in the said Territory, and hold no office of profit under the Territory or the United States. The Governor, by and with advice and consent of the said Legislative Council, or of a majority of them, shall have power to alter, modify, or repeal the laws which may be in force at the commencement of this act. Their Legislative powers shall also extend to all the rightful powers of legislation: but no law shall be valid which is inconsistent with the constitution and laws of the United States, or which shall lay any person under restraint, burden, or disability, on account of his religious opinions, professions, or worship; in all which he shall be free to maintain his own, and not burdened for those of another. The Governor shall publish throughout the said Territory all the laws which shall be made, and shall from time to time report the same to the President of the United States, to be laid before Congress; which, if disapproved of by Congress, shall thenceforth be of no force. The Governor or Legislative Council shall have no power over the primary disposal of the soil, nor to tax the lands of the United States, nor to interfere with the claims to land within the said Territory. The Governor shall convene and prorogue the Legislative Council, whenever he may deem it expedient. It shall be his duty to obtain all the information in his power in relation to the customs, habits, and dispositions of the inhabitants of the said Territory, and communicate the same, from time to time, to the President of the United States.”
“Sec. 4.The Legislative powers shall be vested in the Governor, and in thirteen of the most fit and discreet persons of the Territory, to be called the Legislative Council, who shall be appointed annually by the President of the United States, from among those holding real estate therein, and who shall have resided one year at least in the said Territory, and hold no office of profit under the Territory or the United States. The Governor, by and with advice and consent of the said Legislative Council, or of a majority of them, shall have power to alter, modify, or repeal the laws which may be in force at the commencement of this act. Their Legislative powers shall also extend to all the rightful powers of legislation: but no law shall be valid which is inconsistent with the constitution and laws of the United States, or which shall lay any person under restraint, burden, or disability, on account of his religious opinions, professions, or worship; in all which he shall be free to maintain his own, and not burdened for those of another. The Governor shall publish throughout the said Territory all the laws which shall be made, and shall from time to time report the same to the President of the United States, to be laid before Congress; which, if disapproved of by Congress, shall thenceforth be of no force. The Governor or Legislative Council shall have no power over the primary disposal of the soil, nor to tax the lands of the United States, nor to interfere with the claims to land within the said Territory. The Governor shall convene and prorogue the Legislative Council, whenever he may deem it expedient. It shall be his duty to obtain all the information in his power in relation to the customs, habits, and dispositions of the inhabitants of the said Territory, and communicate the same, from time to time, to the President of the United States.”
Mr.Leibobserved that he did not like the provisions of this section, and least of all that which gave the Governor the right of proroguing the Legislative Council. It appeared to him that that body was the most dependent thing of its nature in the United States; and when the power of prorogation vested in the Governor was considered, it seemed to him that the people would do much better without any such body. This was a royal appendage which he did not like. He, therefore, moved to strike out the words “and prorogue.”
Mr.Greggsaid he was not only in favor of the motion of his colleague, but against the section generally. It would require much further amendment to induce him to vote for it. He was opposed to the power it gave the President to appoint the members of the Legislative Council. It appeared to him a mere burlesque to say they shall be appointed by the President. How is the President to get information of the qualifications for office? This could only be obtained from the officers appointed by him, and principally from the Governor, who will not fail to recommend to the President the appointment of persons favorable to his own views. Mr. G. said that they would, therefore, rather vest the appointment of the members of the Legislative Council in the Governor; the mode pointed out in the bill was only calculated to rescue the Governor from the responsibility attached to his office, by dividing it among others.
Mr.Leibsaid his amendment did not in the least interfere with that of his colleague, with whom he fully accorded in sentiment.
Mr.Varnumwas of opinion that the section in the bill provided such a kind of Government as had never been known in the United States. He thought sound policy, no less than justice, dictated the propriety of making provision for the election of a legislative body by the people. There was not only the common obligation of justice imposed upon Congress to do this, but they were bound by treaty. The treaty with France expressly says:
“The inhabitants of the ceded territory shall be incorporated in the Union of the United States, and admitted as soon as possible, according to the principles of the federal constitution, to the enjoyment of all the rights, advantages, and immunities of citizens of the United States.”
“The inhabitants of the ceded territory shall be incorporated in the Union of the United States, and admitted as soon as possible, according to the principles of the federal constitution, to the enjoyment of all the rights, advantages, and immunities of citizens of the United States.”
The treaty makes it obligatory on the United States to admit the inhabitants of Louisiana, as soon as possible, to the enjoyment of all the rights, advantages, and immunities of citizens of the United States. In order to decide the principle of this section of the bill by an expression of the sense of the committee, he would move that the committee should rise, report progress, and ask leave to sit again, with the view of refusing them leave, and afterwards referring the bill to a select committee to receive a modification in conformity to the opinions of the House.
Mr.Hugertrusted the committee would not rise. He knew not the impressions on this subject on the minds of other gentlemen; but the information lately received from Louisiana convinced him of the propriety of proceeding with the bill immediately. In addition to the principles contained in the section under consideration, there were others of great importance. He thought it would be most advisable, in a future stage of discussion, to commit the bill to a select committee, if any material alterations should be made in it. It was best, at present, to deliberate fully on the several provisions of the bill, and for gentlemen to make an interchange of opinions. Were the bill now committed, the report of the committee would not advance the business in the least, as that report might be as objectionable to the House as the bill from the Senate.
Mr.Elliot, for like reasons assigned by the gentleman from South Carolina, and for other reasons, hoped the committee would not rise. He did not believe the section under consideration was, in its present form, consistent either with the spirit of the constitution or the treaty;but he believed that, by the introduction of a small amendment, the section might be rendered perfectly consistent with them, and the passage of the bill be greatly accelerated. He preferred a middle course between the existing section and the amendment offered by the gentleman from Pennsylvania. Whatever amendments were necessary would be easily offered and discussed at present; whereas no desirable object could be effected by a reference.
Mr.Greggsaid it also appeared to him that no valuable purpose would be answered by referring the bill to a select committee. What can such a committee do? There exists no diversity of sentiment in the House on principle. Some are for giving to the people of the Territory, instead of the President, the power of electing members of the Legislative Council. Here, then, are two distinct principles, and unless the House determine which of them it will adopt, a select committee can do nothing. Let us settle the principle of the bill first, and then refer it to a select committee, to modify it in correspondence with them.
Mr.Eustissaid this subject was, in his opinion, inferior to no other discussed this session. With regard to the provisions of the section under consideration, it was to be expected that there would be a diversity of opinion. Gentlemen inimical to them had taken different grounds. One gentleman desires the power of the Governor to prorogue the Council to be rescinded; another gentleman wishes an entire change in the formation of the Council; and a third is in favor of the committee rising, that the bill may go to a select committee to report different provisions for the government of the people of Louisiana from those contained in the bill before us. This motion necessarily brings the principle on which the Council is organized by the bill before us.
According to this bill, the Governor and Council are to make the laws. Suppose the Council is in session, and the Governor possess no power to prorogue them. Suppose they should engage in acts subversive of their relation to the United States. Would not this power be of essential utility? It appears to me indispensably necessary that a vein of authority should ascend to the Government of the United States, until the people of the Territory are admitted to the full enjoyment of State rights. From that knowledge of this people which I have been able to acquire, I have formed an opinion that authority should be constantly exercised over them, without severity, but in such a manner as to secure the rights of the United States and the peace of the country.
The government laid down in this bill is certainly a new thing in the United States; but the people of this country differ materially from the citizens of the United States. I speak of the character of the people at the present time. When they shall be better acquainted with the principles of our Government, and shall have become desirous of participating in our privileges, it will be full time to extend to them the elective franchise. Have not the House been informed from an authentic source, since the cession, that the provisions of our institutions are inapplicable to them? If so, why attempt, in pursuit of a vain theory, to extend political institutions to them for which they are not prepared? I am one of those who believe that the principles of civil liberty cannot suddenly be ingrafted on a people accustomed to a regimen of a directly opposite hue. The approach of such a people to liberty must be gradual. I believe them at present totally unqualified to exercise it. If this opinion be erroneous, then the principles of the bill are unfounded. If, on the contrary, this opinion is sound, it results that neither the power given to the President to appoint the members of the Council, nor of the Governor to prorogue them, are unsafe or unnecessary.
Mr.Lucaswas against the rising of the committee, inasmuch as the bill under consideration offered the widest field of discussing the subject before them, and inasmuch as it was proper, that the principles of it should be settled by a majority, to enable a select committee to collect the sense of the House. When this decision should have taken place, he should have no objections to a recommitment for the purpose of modifying the bill in consonance with it.
It was known, by the treaty, that the United States are bound to secure to the people of Louisiana as large a portion of liberty and security of rights, as though they remained under the Government of France and Spain; and he trusted the bill as it stood secured to them much more. As an instance, it might be mentioned that the privilege of habeas corpus had never been enjoyed by them while they were connected with either Spain or France. An argument was drawn from the treaty, that these people are to be admitted to the absolute enjoyment of the rights of citizens; but gentlemen would not deny, that the time when, and the circumstances under which this provision of the treaty was to be carried into effect, were submitted to the decision of Congress. It has been remarked, that this bill establishes elementary principles of government never previously introduced in the government of any Territory of the United States. Granting the truth of this observation, it must be allowed that the United States had never before devolved upon them the making provision for the government of people under such circumstances. Governors must not rest on theory, but must raise their political structures on the state of the people for whom they are made. Mr.Lucassaid, that without wishing to reflect on the inhabitants of Louisiana, he would say that they are not prepared for a government like that of the United States. Governed by Spanish officers, exercising authority according to their whim, supported by a military force, it could not be said that a people thus inured to despotism, were prepared on a sudden to receive the principles of our Government.It was questionable whether there was a nation in Europe whom these principles would be so advantageous to as they are to us. It would be recollected by gentlemen, who so strenuously advocated the abstract principle of right, that the people of Louisiana have not been consulted in the act of cession to this country, but had been transferred by a bargain made over their heads. It was a proof this act had not been received with approbation by them, that when they saw the American flag hoisted in the room of the French, they shed tears; this was a proof that they were not so friendly to our Government as some gentlemen imagined. He was persuaded the people of the Mississippi Territory would not have acted in this manner. There is no doubt but that after they shall have experienced the blessings of a free Government, they will wonder at their having shed tears on this occasion; but they must, in the first instance, feel these blessings.
Mr. L. said he was fully of opinion with the gentleman from Massachusetts (Mr.Eustis) in the sentiments he had expressed. The United States had it eminently in their power to make these people happy without an extension to them of all our privileges. They will not be gratified from knowing that the theory of liberty is extended to them, but from its practical effects. The people of Louisiana know but little of political theories, but they will feel the just operation of equal laws; and if they can obtain practical justice, though it may not arise from an extension of our elementary political principles, they will not find fault with it.
Mr. L. said he was not among those who considered the bill, in all its provisions, perfect. He considered it susceptible of much amendment; though not in the principle now under review. In this provision, by declaring that the inhabitants of the Territory shall compose the Legislative Council, a great point is gained by the people. For it cannot be supposed that the inhabitants, thus called upon to discharge high duties to society, will so far lose sight of their own permanent interests as to sacrifice them, together with the good of the country, to whim or corruption.
Their election by the President is another important security. Suppose the Governor shall wish to render the Council his puppets. The President will not feel an interest in gratifying his improper views. It is, however, said that his information will be derived from the Governor. But the fact is, he will receive it in part from the Governor, and in part from others; and he will be sagacious enough to judge, not from a part, but from the whole that reaches him.
A valuable effect will flow from composing the Council of the inhabitants of the country; its members will thereby be initiated in the theory of our Government and laws, and this knowledge will hereafter qualify them for higher political trusts; they will acquire much political knowledge; they will return home, and their conversation with their friends will naturally turn on political topics, and on the laws they have passed; thus will a spirit of inquiry and of political discussion spring up in the country. When this effect shall be produced, it will be time, and only then, to give them a government as liberal and free as that contemplated by the amendment.
Mr.Macon(Speaker) observed that he coincided in opinion with the gentleman from Massachusetts, (Mr.Varnum,) whose object would, he thought, be better tried by a motion to strike out the section. This motion would bring the principle before the House. If the section should be stricken out, the bill would be recommitted for new modification to a select committee. Mr. M. accordingly moved to strike out the fourth section.
This motion having been stated from the Chair,
Mr.Maconagain rose. I will endeavor, said he, to compress my ideas on this point in a few words. My first objection to the principle contained in the section is, that it establishes a species of government unknown to the laws of the United States. We have three descriptions of Government; that of the Union, that of the States, and Territorial governments. I believe the Territorial government, as established by the ordinance of the Old Congress, the best adapted to the circumstances of the people of Louisiana; and that it may be so modified as best to promote their convenience. The people residing in the Mississippi Territory, are now under this kind of government.[8]Is it not likelythat the people of Louisiana will expect the same form of government and laws with their neighbors; and is it not desirable for the general peace and happiness that there should be a correspondence between them? If they are as ignorant as some gentlemen represent them, (and of this I know nothing,) will they not expect the same grade of government with the inhabitants of the Mississippi Territory, with whom they will have a constant intercourse? Although they lived previously under the Spanish Government, and although their number did not entitle them, when formed into a Territory, to the second grade of government, no inconvenience resulted. It is said, in reply to this observation, that a large number of inhabitants of that Territory were Americans. It is true that many of them were native Americans, but some also were Spanish.
The simple question is, what kind of government is most fitted to this people? It is extremely difficult to legislate for a people with whose habits and customs we are unacquainted. I, for one, declare myself unacquainted with them; nor would I in fixing the government, unless for the safety of the Union, do an act capable of disgusting the people for whom it is adopted. It will be a wise policy to avoid whatever is calculated to disgust them. My opinion is that they will be better satisfied with an old-established form of government, than with a new one. Why? Because they have seen it established in the adjacent Territory of Mississippi, and know the manner in which it operates. If there are bad men in Louisiana, will any thing be more easy than to disgust the people against the General Government by showing that they have given one kind of government to the people of the Mississippi Territory, and a different kind to them? In my mind, it is sound policy to give them no cause of complaint. We ought to show them that we consider them one people.
I will not pretend to say that the people of Louisiana are prepared for a State government, which differs most materially from a Territorial government. The best way to prepare them for such a government, is to take the system already known to our laws; one grade or the other of the Territorial government. For myself, I would prefer the adoption of the second grade, but I would prefer the first to any new system. For these reasons, I hope the section will be struck out, and the bill referred to a select committee.
The House went again into a Committee of the Whole on the bill for the government of Louisiana.
The fourth section of the bill being under consideration—
Mr.Jacksonsaid: As this section is the corner stone on which the whole superstructure rests, and involves the most important principle of the bill, I will ask the indulgence of the committee to make a few remarks upon it. It presents two important questions; first, whether it is proper on the broad principle of political justice to adopt it? And secondly, whether it is consistent with our treaty with France? Two questions arise out of the first proposition; first, Is the system consonant to the habits of a free people? And, secondly, if not, is it the best calculated to advance the happiness of those who have never tasted the blessings of liberty? The first question requires no discussion; it will be answered in the negative by every section of this Union. Every section has been engaged in forming a constitution, and both the State and Federal constitutions have decided this point in the negative, because neither partake of the aristocratical or monarchical features contained in this section.
It is urged by gentlemen, that we ought to give to this people liberty by degrees. I believe, however, there is no danger of giving them too much of it; and I am unwilling to tarnish the national character by sanctioning the detestable calumny that man is not fitted for freedom. What will the world say if we sanction this principle? They will say we possess the principle of despotism under the garb of Republicans; and that we are insincere, with whatever solemnity we may declare it, in pronouncing all men equal. They will tell us that we have emphatically declared to the American people and to the world, in our first act evincive of emancipation from the tyranny of England, that all men are equal; and that all governments derive their rightful power from the consent of the governed; and that notwithstanding, when the occasion offers, we exercise despotic power, under the pretext that the people are unable to govern themselves.
Mr.Holland.—As my ideas are very different from those of the gentleman who has preceded me, and as I do not believe that either policy or moral obligation recommends the adoption of a system such as he has avowed to be proper, I will, in a few words, state the sentiments I entertain.
Can gentlemen conceive the people of Louisiana, who have just thrown off their chains,qualified to make laws? Under the late system the people had no concern in the government, and it was even criminal for them to concern themselves with it; they were set at a distance from the government, and all required from their hands was, to be passive and obedient. Can it be supposed such a people made the subject of government their study, or can it be presumed they know any thing about the principles of the Constitution of the United States? Would persons thus elected be of any service to the Government? So far from being an assistance, they would be an encumbrance. Why then impose this burden upon them? The object of this bill is to extend the laws of the United States over Louisiana, not to enable the people of Louisiana to make laws. This extension, so far from being an act of despotism, will be an important privilege. If the laws of the United States were founded in injustice they might have some right to complain, but we only apply to them laws by which we ourselves consent to be governed.
The provisions of this section are said to be worse than those of the first grade of Territorial governments; but this is incorrect. This plan is not equal to the second grade, but it is certainly superior to the first grade. The first grade gives the Governor and judges all the powers granted by this section; and this section, in addition to the Governor and judges, contemplates the appointment of thirteen councillors. Is not this preferable to giving the whole power to the Governor and judges?
Mr.Boylesaid he should not have risen on this occasion but for the impression that some arguments of weight had been omitted, or had not been sufficiently dwelt on. In the few remarks he purposed to make, he should endeavor to avoid a repetition of ideas already expressed. It was not so much to the novelty, as to the nature of the plan of government contained in the fourth section, that he was opposed. He did not consider the Territorial government proposed to be substituted as perfect, but he believed it infinitely preferable to that contemplated in the bill. Preferring, therefore, either grade to this, said Mr. B., I shall concur in supporting the substitution of the second grade as most fitted to the circumstances of the people of Louisiana. I feel peculiarly hostile to the mode of appointing the Legislative Council. The power of appointing them is unnecessarily vested in the President. Waiving all objection arising from the distance of the President from the men to be appointed; from the necessity of his relying on the representations of others as to their qualifications, and his liability to be deceived by misrepresentations; still one objection remains, which, to my mind, is most important. I am, said Mr. B., unwilling to extend executive patronage beyond the line of irresistible necessity. For, I believe, if ever this country is to follow the destiny of other nations, this destiny will be accelerated by the overwhelming torrent of executive patronage. I feel as high a veneration for the present Chief Magistrate as any man on this floor. Early attached to him, I have retained the full force of my regard for him. But, were he an angel, instead of a man, I would not clothe him with this power; because, in my estimation, the investiture of such high powers is unnecessary. My opinion is, that they will be more properly exercised by the people. To give them to the President is to furnish a dangerous precedent for extending executive power and patronage; and as he has himself said, one precedent in favor of power is stronger than a hundred against it. I am in favor of giving to the people all that portion of self-government and independence which is compatible with the constitution.
The House resolved itself into a Committee of the Whole on the bill providing for the settlement of sundry claims to public lands lying south of the State of Tennessee; to which Committee of the Whole were also referred, on the twentieth ultimo, a motion containing sundry resolutions “respecting claimants to the said lands under an act of the Legislature of the State of Georgia, passed in the year one thousand seven hundred and ninety-five.”
Mr. J.Randolphcalled for the reading of sundry resolutions lately offered by him on this subject. The resolutions having been read, Mr. R. said, when he had submitted them, it was with the view of trying the question then before the committee as he thought fairly. It was no part of his intention to embarrass the operations of the friends of the bill, further than to take the sense of the committee and of the House on each specific proposition embraced by the resolutions. His wish, therefore, was, that the sense of the committee, in the first instance, should be taken on the resolutions. If they should be rejected, the vote of rejection would be a virtual admission of the claims of 1795; and gentlemen might then modify the bill in such manner as might best please them to do.
Mr.Mitchill.—These resolutions tend to involve Congress in the proceedings of the State of Georgia. I consider myself as one of those who, by assenting to certain acts heretofore passed by Congress, have consented to a hearing and compromise with the grantees. If this construction be correct, the Committee are precluded from adopting these resolutions; nor is it proper, in my opinion, for Congress to go into a view of the proceedings of Georgia on this occasion. That State is sovereign to a certain extent, and this Government possesses no right to interfere with her sovereignty. Attached to this sovereignty is the right of granting land belonging to her. But it is alleged that Georgia was, in the year 1795, in a disorderly state, and that a certain Legislature in that year did a certain act which a subsequentLegislature declared to be totally unauthorized. This may be so. It is certain the second Legislature declared the act of the first null, under circumstances of a very extraordinary nature. I do not, however, see that it is our duty to give an opinion whether the Legislature of Georgia acted wickedly or uprightly. Whichever course they may have pursued, I do not believe this body to be a constitutional board of censors. We find frequent occasions enough on which, without going out of our way, our duty calls upon us to give our opinions. Believing this to be an occasion on which no opinion is required from us, and one which it is most prudent to pass by without giving such opinion, I wish not to vote for or against the resolutions. I am, therefore, for the committee’s rising and reporting the bill.
Mr. J.Randolph.—I had hoped that when these resolutions were sent from the House to the committee, they would have received the respectful attention to which every such reference is entitled; and that the committee would at least have deemed them worthy of some expression of opinion on them; that they would have deigned to say whether the reasoning or facts contained in them are or are not erroneous and unfounded. The gentleman from New York tells the committee that, by an act passed at a previous session of Congress, a pledge has been given to a certain description of claimants under the act of 1795, to do something in relation to their claims. If so, is this a reason for not acting on the resolutions? No; it is a reason for taking them up and rejecting them. One of those resolutions says, and I am prepared to prove it true, and I call on gentlemen to show its falsehood, “that the claims of persons derived under the act of January first, 1795, are recognized neither by any compact between the United States and the State of Georgia, nor by any act of the Federal Government.” I deny that they are so recognized. If they are, what can be easier than for the learned gentleman to refer to the compact under which they are recognized? This he cannot show, and hence his unwillingness to express an opinion. At an antecedent session we passed a law on this subject. The gentleman may have given his vote for this law under the impression he states, but it does not follow that the Legislature acted under the same impression; on the contrary, I know several gentlemen who voted for it, though hostile to the claims under the act of 1795, because it contained a general provision for claims, and did not particularly recognize those arising under the act of 1795; and now, because Congress have passed an act of a general nature, when it was notorious there are a variety of claims besides those under the act of 1795, and none of which are mentioned either in the compact or treaty with the State of Georgia, it is said we have given a pledge, and we are called upon to fulfil it. And this language is held by gentlemen who, in the same breath, have expressed a disposition to reject another description of claims. Could absurdity speak in stronger language? A general appropriation has been made by Congress for claims; the claims preferred are of two classes—those under the acts of 1789 and 1795. There might have been claims of a hundred other descriptions—for all these Congress have made a general appropriation—and yet we are told by gentlemen hostile to the claims of 1789 that we are pledged to provide for those of 1795. If we are pledged to satisfy one description, are we not equally pledged to the other? But the truth is, we have given no pledge. If we have, nothing is so easy as to refer to the statute book, and to point it out. No such pledge is recognized by our compact with Georgia. While I am up, permit me to say, if the compact with Georgia be construed according to its letter, the appropriation of $5,000,000 ought to be considered as not embracing claims under the act of 1795, for the best reason in the world: the statute book of Georgia shows the reason. But, say gentlemen, we possess the power to satisfy these claims, though such satisfaction may not have been contemplated by our compact with Georgia. There must, say they, have been an understanding between the Commissioners of Georgia and our Commissioners in favor of compromising them, and therefore it is inferred that we ought to be governed more by thequo animowith which the compact was formed than by its strict letter; it is accordingly attempted to be proved, that there was an understanding between our Commissioners and those of Georgia, that relief should be extended to claimants under the act of 1795. I am authorized by the Commissioners to say that this was not the case. Whether, therefore, we are governed by the strict letter of the contract, or by thequo animo, we cannot discover the grounds for this opinion. I have been told, in a way which removes all doubts, by the Commissioners on both sides, at least by a Commissioner of the United States having a great participation in the business, and by the Georgia Commissioners, that the stipulation in the compact was not inserted at the instance of Georgia, but reluctantly inserted by them at the instance of the Commissioners of the United States.
Mr.Macon(Speaker) remarked that this question, like many others which presented themselves, had taken up a long time in discussing the preliminary point that might have been required on the resolutions. To rise and report the bill, without acting on the resolutions, would be a virtual rejection of them; especially as the House had determined to rise on the 19th. For one, Mr. M. said, he was ready to vote on the resolutions. If it were wrong to vote on them, it was certainly proper to vote against their reference. But why not vote on them? We may not all agree; but have we not a right to think for ourselves? Let us then meet them, and vote as we see best. Mr. M. said he was more desirous of meeting the question, as he differed from those withwhom he generally coincided in opinion. It may be said the resolutions embrace an abstract question. If so, gentlemen ought not to have allowed their reference. In the present stage of the business, no question could be taken unless in the committee, or on a motion to discharge the committee from their further consideration. Mr. M. said, he thought it the right of every member of a deliberative body to express his sentiments and record his opinion on any subject before it. This had always been the practice. He trusted, therefore, the committee would not rise, but proceed to the discussion of the resolutions.
Mr.J. Randolph.—I little expected to stand on this floor, in the list of persons hostile to State rights—to be charged, as the gentleman before me has expressed himself, with having brought forward propositions subversive of the rights of the States. The sovereignty of the States has ever been the cardinal principle of my political opinions, and in the outset, I enlisted under the banner of State rights in opposition to federal usurpation. The doctrine of exalting the General Government on the ruin of the authority of the States, is at length exploded, and those who have heretofore been most conspicuous in encroaching upon the rights of the States, generally, and upon those of Georgia in particular, are now foremost in displaying their zeal for both. I cannot but rejoice at the acquisition which this cause has made. But to those of its friends who are too new to it to understand its interests as yet, I would recommend, that they would take the conduct of the Georgia delegation as an evidence of the rights and interests of that State. They surely are not so destitute of information or fidelity, as to misunderstand or abandon the rights of the people whom they represent.—So long, however, as I have the honor of concurring with them in opinion, I shall be very easy under any clamor which the new friends of Georgia and of the rights of States may endeavor to excite. If, however, gentlemen are unwilling to rely on the opinions of so few, however respectable men, I refer them to the act of the Legislature of Georgia herself, generally called the rescinding act, passed under circumstances of unparalleled unanimity, and confirmed by the general voice of the people, who subsequently recognized it in, and ingrafted it upon their constitution. If still they remain dissatisfied, I would ask them if the recognition of the claims against Georgia, in the bill which they are so eager to pass, be not equally a violation of the rights of that State, with the rejection of those claims. Does not the bill before you, in pronouncing upon the validity of the act of Georgia, equally involve the principle against which gentlemen protest so loudly, with the resolutions themselves? They have their choice either to pronounce the corrupt act of 1795, or the rescinding act of 1796, invalid. Are not the rights of Georgia as much affected by the one as by the other? and even more, by annulling the act of 1796, since she alone recognizes that to be her own.
Here Mr. R. read the first and second resolutions: