Mrs.Bledsoe. Not after he got off the bus; no.
Mr.Ball. But, you looked at the pictures of Oswald?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. Showed you the pictures of Oswald?
Mrs.Bledsoe. The man down at the police station, he had a picture of him with a gun, and said, "Do you recognize him?"
And I said, "Yes; it is Oswald." That is the one that I remember him.
Mr.Ball. Do you know the name of the man who showed you the picture of the man with the gun?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I am so bad about names.
Mr.Ball. Was there one man or more than one man?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, about a dozen.
Mr.Ball. Oh, a dozen men?
Mrs.Bledsoe. There sure was a lot of them. Two Secret Service men, and two to do this, and oh, I had interviewed about 9 or 10 or 12, plenty of them.
Mr.Ball. Now, I have got a piece of clothing here, which ismarked——
Mrs.Bledsoe. That is it.
Mr.Ball. Commission Exhibit 150.
Mrs.Bledsoe. That is it.
Mr.Ball. This is ashirt——
Mrs.Bledsoe. That is it.
Mr.Ball. What do you mean by "that is it?"
Mrs.Bledsoe. Because they brought it out to the house and showed it.
Mr.Ball. I know. What do you mean by "this is it?"
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, because I can recognize it.
Mr.Ball. Recognize it as what?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes, sir; see there?
Mr.Ball. Yes. You tell me what do you see here? What permits you to recognize it?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I recognize—first thing I notice the elbow is out and then I saw—when the man brought it out and let me see it?
Mr.Ball. No, I am talking about—I am showing you this shirt now, and you said, "That is it." You mean—What do you mean by "that is it"?
Mrs.Bledsoe. That is the one he had out there that day?
Mr.Ball. Who had it out there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Some Secret Service man.
Mr.Ball. He brought it out. Now, I am—you have seen this shirt then before?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. It was brought out by the Secret Service man and shown to you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. Had you ever seen the shirt before that?
Mrs.Bledsoe.Well——
Mr.Ball. Have you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he had it on, though.
Mr.Ball. Who had it on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oswald.
Mr.Ball. Oswald had it on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oswald had it on.
Mr.Ball. Now, what is there about the shirt that makes you believe that this is the shirt that Oswald had on when he was on the bus? What is there about it?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, let's see the front of it. Yes. See all this [indicating]? I remember that.
Mr.Ball. Tell me what you see there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I saw the—no; not so much that. It was done after—that is the part I recognize more than anything.
Mr.Ball. You are pointing to a hole in the right elbow?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. What about the color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I—What do you mean?
Mr.Ball.Well——
Mrs.Bledsoe. When he had it on?
Mr.Ball. Yes.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Before he was shot? Yes; I remember it being brown.
Mr.Ball. You remember the shirt being brown.
Was it this color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; it was that color.
Mr.Ball. In other words, when you remember that you have seen somethingbefore——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Ball. In order to convince me that you did see it before you've got to tell me what there is about it that is the same, you see. Now, you try to convince me, or tell me why it is that you believe that this is the shirt that Oswald had on when you saw him on the bus?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I would say it was. Thathole——
Mr.Ball. Mostly the hole in the right sleeve?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. What about the color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; I remember the color.
Mr.Ball. That is a similar color, isn't it?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; same color.
Mr.Ball. Same color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Ball. You think that is the shirt?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; it is the shirt.
Mr.Ball. Had you ever seen him wear this shirt before, when he was around your house?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Ball. First time you ever saw the shirt was when you saw him on the bus?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Ball. I have two exhibits here. One Commission Exhibit 157. Exhibit 157, and Commission 156, both pants. Have you ever seen either one of those before?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Now, is that long pants?
Mr.Ball. Yes; this is 157.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, that is not the ones he had on.
Mr.Ball. That is not?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it was ragged up at the top.
Mr.Ball. This other pair of pants, 156, does that look like any of the pants he had on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. That must have been it, but seemed like it was ragged up at the top.
Mr.Ball. But, you think 156 may have been the pair of pants he had on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Ball. You think 157—don't pay any attention to the fact that it is cut up—does 157 look anything like the pants he had on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; Idon't——
Mr.Ball. You don't think so?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, sir.
Mr.Ball. I have no more questions to ask you now, Mrs. Bledsoe, but Mr. Jenner will ask you some questions.
Mrs.Bledsoe. All right.
Mr.Jenner. I will get up here close so you will hear me all right.
Mrs.Bledsoe. All right.
Mr.Jenner. I would like to go back to the day that he came to your home on the 7th of October?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. You were out in your backyard?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. And did he come back there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. Did you have a bell on your house?
Mrs.Bledsoe. He knocked at the door.
Mr.Jenner. He knocked at the door and you heard him knock at the door?
Mrs.Bledsoe. And I went around the front.
Mr.Jenner. And your home is all at one level?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. So, you walked through your house?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I went through the yard and come around from the back to the front yard.
Mr.Jenner. And you saw a young man at the door?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. How was that young man dressed on that occasion?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I don't remember what he had on. Didn't pay any attention. He was clean and that's all you see, but I didn't know what color the pants were and what kind of shirt it was.
Mr.Jenner. Well, did he have a suit on or sportscoat, or just his shirt?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Just the shirt. It was hot weather. October.
Mr.Jenner. Do you recall—did he have a tie on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. The shirt, that was open at the front?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes, it wasn't those short shirts. I don't know what kind it was. I didn't pay any attention to him.
Mr.Jenner. And this was a Monday morning.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Monday afternoon.
Mr.Jenner. Monday afternoon. Did he have a hat on?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. Was he—did he have any luggage?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; had one bag, I don't know whether it was a duffel or what, but then he went on and got another one.
Mr.Jenner. Well, if you will permit me to stay with what he had when you first sawhim——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. You call on your recollection and tell me all you can tell me about the bag he had at that time, its size, its shape. In another connection, Mrs. Bledsoe, it is prior events that are important to us. If we can possibly find out or get as accurate a description as you can give us. Sit there relaxed and tell us what you remember about this bag, what size it was; what shape it was; whether it was hard; whether it was soft, what color it was.
Was it zippered? How was it fastened?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I don't know whether it was zippered or not. But seems to me like it was, though.
Mr.Jenner. Just start from the beginning and tell us what you remember about the bag that he had when you first saw him at the door.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, it was just a blue—like a canvas bag.
Mr.Jenner. Canvas?
Mrs.Bledsoe. And, I don't know whether it was zippered or not.
Mr.Jenner. You don't recall a zippered sort of bag?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't even look. It was about that long, I guess [indicating].
Mr.Jenner. You are indicating about 26 inches?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. About that long.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Then, he had some things on his back.
Mr.Jenner. Now, would you mind if we stuck with the bag?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, that's all.
Mr.Jenner. Well, it was 26 inches long and you think it was canvas, and you think it was blue in color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. What was its shape? Was it a round sort of soft kind of bag or was it—did it have firm, stiff sides? Was it rectangular?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I couldn't say. Couldn't say. Didn't pay any attention to it.
Mr.Jenner. Your recollection does serve you that it was not what we would call a suitcase?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; looked like an inexpensive bag of some kind.
Mr.Jenner. And your memory doesn't serve you that there was any sort of zipper thing, and you do seem to have a reasonably firm recollection that the color of it was blue?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. Did it have a handle on it?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. When he picked itup——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, thatis——
Mr.Jenner. I was trying to get an idea, and well—I have a coat here, and using it for purposes of illustration, when he picked up the bag by the handles did the bag sag, or was it firm?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't pay any attention. Didn't pay a bit of attention.
Mr.Jenner. Now, I notice from your testimony that he also had, on this occasion, at this time, in addition to the canvas bag, blue in color, he had some things over his arm, or over his shoulder?
Mrs.Bledsoe. On a coathanger.
Mr.Jenner. He had some articles of clothing?
Mrs.Bledsoe. On coathangers.
Mr.Jenner. On coathangers?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And were those draped back over the shoulder or arm, or was he holding them by the hooks or hooks on the hangers?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I think he had them on coathangers, just—I guess—I don't know—he was standing there. I don't have no idea.
Mr.Jenner. Just how he was carrying them, you are uncertain, but you are certain that he had articles of clothing on hangers?
Mr.Bledsoe. On coathangers.
Mr.Jenner. Were—would they be wooden coathangers or the metal?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Metal ones.
Mr.Jenner. The type you get when you send clothes to the cleaners and they come back on these wire, metal hangers, what—was that the type?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I imagine. I couldn't tell. Now, I—no; I didn't pay any attention to him.
Mr.Jenner. Your recollection serves you now that there were hangers, but you cannot recall whether they were the wire type or whether they were wooden?
Mrs.Bledsoe. When he left, he just carried them off. I never did look at his clothes at all.
Mr.Jenner. You impress me as a lady that wouldn't be fussing around?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't care enough about it. All I wanted him to do was rent the room.
Mr.Jenner. Now, you had a discussion, and you rented the room to him for $7 for that week?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. And he paid you then and there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh
Mr.Jenner. In cash?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; and I gave him a receipt on this book.
Mr.Jenner. Now, he then left your home?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. Did he say anything about why he was leaving?
Mrs.Bledsoe. He went to the grocery store. No, no; first he went to get his other bag.
Mr.Jenner. What did he say then?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Didn't say anything.
Mr.Jenner. How did you come to know that he went to get another bag?
Mrs.Bledsoe. He didn't say—he just went off.
Mr.Jenner. He just turned around without any leave taking?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; because he was not a man to talk, you know, what I got out of him, I had to get it out of him, because it was hard to—because I wanted to see what kind of a person he was, and it was hard to get, you know, to judge him in such a short time.
Mr.Jenner. When you completed the transaction about his renting the room and you got your $7, he paid it to you, so it was agreed he had the room for a week, did he go in and look at the room before he paid you the $7?
Mrs.Bledsoe. He was in the room, and I was at the door, and he looked at it and I said, $7, so, he took it and give me the money all in ones, $7.
Mr.Jenner. Seven $1 bills?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Seven $1 bills, and then he come over to my room and I—he wrote it down, and it is a good thing I had him write it, because I am kind of nervous, and I don't write so well, see, and he put it down on that, and that—and so, that is—this is in September, butanyway——
Mr.Jenner. Yes; I appreciate that.
Mrs.Bledsoe.October——
Mr.Jenner.Well——
MissDouthit. Let me ask her this question about that bag, if it was puffed out, or approximately what shape it was, also, as to any further conversation that she had as to his background, how much she knows. If you are interested. You might not be.
Mr.Jenner. Mr. Robert Davis of the attorney general's office of Texas has come in, and I am not seeking to press you, but we have some problems of the highest degree of exactitude that we can obtain. And at the risk of boring you, I would like to go back to that bag again.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, that; I didn't pay much attention to it.
Mr.Jenner. When you first saw him at the door at your front of your home, he had the bag?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. Was it resting on the porch, or was he standing before the door with bag in hand when you first saw him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I come around the house, you see, and I don't know. I didn't pay—I don't know, couldn't tell you whether he was carrying it or what, buthe did have these things on his shoulder, on his hangers. It—maybe had it sitting down, I don't know. I guess he did. I didn't pay any attention to it.
Mr.Jenner. And at that point you were asking why he was there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he asked me if I had a room for rent.
Mr.Jenner. Yes.
Mrs.Bledsoe. And I said, "Yes," and I thought, "Well, are you married?" And he said, "Yes,"and——
Mr.Jenner. You asked?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. You inquired of him as to his history?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. What did you inquire of him, and what did he say?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I wanted to find out something about him, and he said, "Well, I just want the room for a week or two, because I am going to get a job and then I will have my wife here."
Mr.Jenner. He told you at that time and informed you that he was unemployed?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And he would be seeking work?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And he said that he was going to bring his wife?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And—when and if he obtained employment?
Mrs.Bledsoe. And so, that give me a lead, something to talk about, and I said, "Well, what kind of work do you do?
"Oh, I do electronics," he said, and I said, "Well, there is some good jobs because you are young, and you can get a good job a young man like you."
And then went on. Then something about him being in the Marines, and I said, "Well, that is wonderful. My son was in the Navy."
And talking about him, you know, just getting to know him, and—but, "here is a picture of my wife, and picture of the girl, and the baby."
And I said, "Oh, she has got a baby, hasn't she?"
And he said, "Yes."
And everything he said, I had to pull it out of him to talk about something for him to say what it was.
Mr.Jenner. But, he volunteered the picture of his wife and child?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; he did that. Showed me that picture.
Mr.Jenner. Was that an ordinary snapshot picture?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh. It was in his billfold.
Mr.Jenner. Took it out of his billfold?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, sir; it was in the billfold. Just showed it in the billfold.
Mr.Jenner. I see. I have a billfold here. Was it this type?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it was something else. Don't seem like it was like that. Seemed like it opened this other way,I——
Mr.Jenner. This?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; I think it was like that.
Mr.Jenner. Did he carry it in his trouser pocket, coat pocket?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't pay any attention where he had it.
Mr.Jenner. What other inquiries did you make of him to become better acquainted and find out about him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. He said he had been in the Marines and I thought that was a pretty good recommendation, and I said, "Well, you won't have any trouble at all getting any job."
And so, the next morning I was helping him looking for a job.
Mr.Jenner. Now, pardon me, if you will just stick to while you're at the door now.
Mrs.Bledsoe.Well——
Mr.Jenner.And——
MissDouthit. Just one interruption, but find out if this conversation took place at the door, or after he got in the room.
They are in this room, you see.
Mr.Jenner. You went inside the house almost immediately?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; I did.
Mr.Jenner. When he first made an inquiry?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And you took him to show him the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And your inquiries were—with respect to his history were in the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. And he showed you the picture while you were in the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I think so.
Mr.Jenner. And I take it, am I correct, when you went into the room he had that bag, and he had the articles of clothing?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And had them with him, didn't leave them on the porch?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. What did he do with the bag when he entered the room? Did he put it down on the floor?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Didn't pay any attention.
Mr.Jenner. Didn't pay any attention? What did he do with the articles of clothing on the hangers?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I wasn't paying any attention to it. I guess he hung them up. Just a young boy, and I was trying to see if he was clean, and if he was very intelligent, and he was going to go to work, so, I didn't have too much to work on. Told me he had a nice wife, so, I didn't have anything to say.
Mr.Jenner. When your son was in the Navy, did he have a duffelbag?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No. Now, it was so long ago—it was—I don't know whether he did. I don't think he did. He didn't. He was an instructor at TI.
Mr.Jenner. Was he stationed here in Dallas?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, TI. Treasure Island.
Mr.Jenner. Oh, Treasure Island. How long did this discussion with him in the room take?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, I guess 10 minutes because those—he was—you know, old people, they want to get you out of the way. They don't want to listen to you, but I wanted to find out, so, I think I maybe asked him too many questions, but I wanted him to say something to me and he said something about his—I said, "Do you have a family here," and he said, "Yes, my family lives here."
Well, he wouldn't say his mother or anything, and I didn't ask him everything.
MissDouthit.Well——
Mr.Jenner. All right.
(Discussion off the record.)
Mr.Jenner. Did you notice anything in addition to the hangers with respect to these clothes? Were the articles of clothing enclosed in any kind of a bag or paper, plastic, or otherwise?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, just on hangers.
Mr.Jenner. Just on hangers.
Mrs.Bledsoe. But I didn't pay any attention to what kind of—I think maybe a coat. I don't know what it was, a sweater or something.
Mr.Jenner. Did you see how many articles of clothing were there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, about four.
Mr.Jenner. And none of them was enclosed in any kind of a container, plastic or otherwise?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. Was he pleasant during all of the conversation you had with him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Was the first day. Next day didn't talk any more. I didn't talk to him.
Mr.Jenner. As soon as he—recalling to mind that he paid you the $7.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. Did any further conversation take place after he paid you the $7?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; that is when he asked where the grocery store was.
Mr.Jenner. I see. What else?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, he didn't say anything about going to get the rest of his things. I think that he must have been—said that after he came back with the other bag.
Mr.Jenner. Must have said what?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Where was the grocery store, after he come back and got theother——
Mr.Jenner. So, your recollection presently serves you that he paid you the $7 and no further conversation took place?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. He turned and left the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I—he was—I was in the room, I just walked out.
Mr.Jenner. You walked out after the transaction, financially, was complete?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I went and he paid—he had already paid me but I wanted him to put his name on here.
Mr.Jenner. On your register?
Mrs.Bledsoe. On this [indicating].
Mr.Jenner. He didthat——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. In your presence?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; in the living room.
Mr.Jenner. Your recollection was that he wrote the words "Lee Oswald"?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Lee Oswald.
Mr.Jenner. Then did he leave your home?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; huh.
Mr.Jenner. Without saying anything to you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. And he was gone—did he return?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; within about 40 minutes, I guess.
Mr.Jenner. And he was gone about 40 minutes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. And got the rest of his things.
Mr.Jenner. When he returned did you see him before he entered your home?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I don't remember.
Mr.Jenner. Do you have a recollection of having seen him before he entered his room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. When did you become aware of the fact he had returned?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I must have heard him, or he might have come in and put his milk in the icebox.
Mr.Jenner. Well, he didn't get the milk, as far as I recall, until you'd advised him where the grocery store was.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. That was after he had returned fromthe——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Fromthe——
Mr.Jenner. After this 40-minute interval? I am just sticking for the moment to the time that he returned to your home after 40 minutes.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. He had put his name in your register and in your presence, in the living room, and turned and left your home and returned in 40 minutes; now, is that right? It's that point that I am concentrating on. When did you become aware that he had returned on that occasion and how?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I don't know—I guess he come and put the things in the icebox. I don't even remember where I was.
Mr.Jenner. I see. So, that you didn't see him return to your home?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't see him come in.
Mr.Jenner. Didn't see him come in?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. And you didn't know what he had with him at that point?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. To the best of your ability where was he in your home when you became aware of his presence on his return after that 40 minutes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I must have been in the kitchen and he came back there and put the milk in, I guess.
Mr.Jenner. Did he have milk with him after he returned that 40 minutes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, not the 40 minutes. That was the bag.
Mr.Jenner. See, this is what I'm trying to concentrate on for the moment, before you get the milk. And I am trying to take it sequentially. He paid the $7 and signed the register in your living room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And without any further words to you he turned and left your home, is that accurate?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; that's about right.
Mr.Jenner. He returned in 40 minutes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. Now, sticking right to that point, when did you become aware of the fact that he was then back in your home, that is, at that point?
Mrs.Bledsoe. That he—he hadn't gotten the milk yet?
Mr.Jenner. No; this is when he first returned.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I don't know. I was just around the house. I didn't pay any attention to him.
Mr.Jenner. So, I take it, then, when he made that first trip back, you didn't see him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. You don't know what he had with him on that occasion?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I guess he had the bag, didn't he?
Mr.Jenner. I want to stick with what you knew at that instant of time. What you found out afterwards, I'll go into that in a moment.
You didn't see him return?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. You don't know what he had with him when he returned?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. At that instance, because you didn't see him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. But, you were aware; now, you became aware of the fact that he did return?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. Did you have a conversation with him at that point?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. When did you become aware and I gather from your earlier testimony you became aware that he had brought that into your home, or there was in your home some additional luggage. When you first saw him he had this soft canvas bag, or canvas bag, whether it was soft or not that is uncertain.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. And then you became aware later that day that there was another piece of luggage, and, am I correct about that?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Now, I think he said he was going to get some more. He was going to get some more and he had some boots, too, in his hand. I—maybe he brought those the last time. I don't remember.
Mr.Jenner. What kind of boots?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, they looked like they were about up to here [indicating].
Mr.Jenner. Up to the knee?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; about there [indicating].
Mr.Jenner.Oh,——
Mrs.Bledsoe. There.
Mr.Jenner. Just a little above the ankle?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. About 3 inches above the ankle?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I don't know what they used them for.
Mrs.Jenner. Were they cowboy boots.
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it wasn't cowboy boots.
Mr.Jenner. Were they canvas, leather, or rubber?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; just leather.
Mr.Jenner. Heavy-soled?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Heavy-soled.
Mr.Jenner. Heavy-soled. Rubber soles?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, no; leather.
Mr.Jenner. Any hobnails in them?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. Hard heel or flat heel? I mean, flat sole and heel?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, they had a heel, too. I remember them having that. He must have brought those in when he brought those the last time.
Mr.Jenner. You do not recall his having the boots at the time you first—at the first time you talked to him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I don't believe he did.
Mr.Jenner. But, you became aware of the boots afterward?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. At, or about, or after the time he returned from this 40-minute absence?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. And was it at the time you noticed the boots, did you also notice that he had additional items of luggage?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, he went to get the luggage.
Mr.Jenner. Did he say that?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I don't know whether he did or not. I know he—I don't know.
Mr.Jenner. Did you have a thought in mind when he left after he paid you the $7 and signed your register that he was going somewhere to obtain additional articles of clothing?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I thought that.
Mr.Jenner. You thought that? He didn't say anything to you about that, however?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he didn't say anything. Didn't talk much.
Mr.Jenner. It is clear in your mind that he just turned around after you finished the transaction and left and returned in 40 minutes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I thought he said he had to get some groceries, but maybe that was after he got the luggage, I don't remember.
Mr.Jenner. You had become aware that afternoon that he had additional articles of luggage?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Come in about 3, about 4 he got the rest of the luggage.
Mr.Jenner. Now, this additional article of luggage, would you describe it, as comparedwith——
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't payany——
Mr.Jenner. Please. As compared with this canvas bag, blue in color, that you just told me about?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I didn't pay no attention to it at all. It was just a piece of luggage.
Mr.Jenner. Well, was ita——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Idon't——
Mr.Jenner. What I would call a suitcase or what you might call a suitcase?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it wasn't a regular suitcase, but just something inexpensive, just something the boys have, and I didn't pay any attention to him.
Mr.Jenner. Was it hard-sided?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it was a—you know, it was weak, you know.
Mr.Jenner. Uh-huh. It was weak. Was it strong enough so that it had a rectangular shape?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
Mr.Jenner. You know what I mean by suitcase?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
Mr.Jenner. It is reasonably firm and hard, and has a handle on it?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; it wasn't that way. One of those inexpensive kind of things, but I don't know whether it was canvas or what.
Mr.Jenner. Was it firmer in shape than the canvas bag you have described to me that he had earlier?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No. Well, I think it was chuck full.
Mr.Jenner. You know it was?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh. It was, I remember. Idon't——
Mr.Jenner. Do you remember the color?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No. One of them was blue, and I don't know which one or anything about it.
Mr.Jenner. I see.
MissDouthit. Let me ask her something.
Mary, would it help you to remember this if you would just begin, you were out in the yard, and you went around and interviewed this man there, did you stand in the yard, or go in your room and talk? Did he put up his things then before he came across the hall to talk to you? When did he ask you about groceries? After he signed your register did he go back in his room and hang his clothes up, or what happened? Would it help if you just sit here idly without anybody asking you questions and see? Did you go back out in the yard after he paid you the money, and while he was gone—if you can, just retrace your steps without anybody interrupting you. Could you begin and go again out in the yard, and went around and saw this man here, and he told you he wanted to rent a room, whether you stood on the porch and talked to him, or whether he brought his things and you went on and showed him the room? How far is the room from where your front door was? If you go down a hall, how far? Did you go over there and talk to him and make arrangements about the rent of the room? Did he hang up his clothes while he was in the room?
Did he—if you can just trace your steps and give it to him. I ask you to do that, and I know it is confusing, but that's all he wants.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I am getting tired.
MissDouthit. All he wants is the truth, and I thought maybe you might, for the sake of the record, youknow——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I would have—we have said most everything.
MissDouthit. I know it, but just do it one more time. The man was standing at your frontdoor——
Mrs.Bledsoe. I am getting tired, because I have had a stroke, you see.
MissDouthit. Did you go back out in the yard?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I stayed in.
MissDouthit. Did he leave your house twice? Now, you said he went and got a bag and brought it back?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes; he did, brought back the bag.
MissDouthit. Then he went back again?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
MissDouthit. How long was he—all I want to know is just, if you can just tell that in your own words without any questions. Could you just do that?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I'd rather they asked,because——
MissDouthit. I know, but it is hard for them to ask these particular questions, because they don't know exactly what happened. All they want to do is to say that you were in the room with him, and put this little bag down and hung up his clothes, and came across the hall and signed the register, see.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, that's all. I don't know whether he put his clothes and what in the other room. I don't know whether he put hisbag——
MissDouthit. Was there a closet in there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
MissDouthit. Well, were you with him when he put the clothes in the closet, or did you go on across the hall and leave him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, no; I didn't pay any attention to him.
MissDouthit. Did you leave his presence—Mary, pardon me, I am not—this is not for the record.
Mr.Jenner. No; that's fine, leave it on the record.
MissDouthit. All right. When the man was on your front porch.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
MissDouthit. He had a blue bag in there?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
MissDouthit. And you don't know whether it was round or bulging, you just don't know?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. You don't know whether it had a long strap or a little handle, do you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I think it had a handle.
MissDouthit. But, it wasn't one you sling over your shoulder?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. All right, can you go ahead?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Clothes were sort of hanging over here [indicating].
MissDouthit. Uh-huh. Not covered or anything?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. You couldn't tell anybody about what color the clothes were, could you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. Did you stand in the yard and talk to the young man? Or immediately go into the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I immediately—I was talking to him, but I had to go in immediately, because he wanted to see the room.
MissDouthit. All right. How far is it, Mrs. Bledsoe, from where you met this man at the front door until you showed him the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, it is about 25 foot, and all that time I had to size him up, you see.
MissDouthit. You were talking to him as you went down the hall?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes;getting——
MissDouthit. Is that where you learned that he was married, as you were walking down the hall?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he told me he was married before we went in the house.
MissDouthit. All right, then, when you got to the room, did you both walk inside the room, or stand in the door and talk?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I stood in the door, and he went in and looked at it and took it.
MissDouthit. Did he keep his clothes?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I didn't pay any attention.
MissDouthit. When he was talking to you, you don't know what he did, just stood and talked to you?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
MissDouthit. Did you leave his presence before he came into your room and signed the register?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Now, that,Melody——
MissDouthit. Were you with him? And took him into the room,and——
Mrs.Bledsoe. Says, "I'll take the room."
MissDouthit. Did you leave him in the room and you go on across to your room? How far is your room from where you rented his room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Right next to it. No; he came on in, he came on back behind me.
MissDouthit. He never left your presence from the time you went in this room until he came over here?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
MissDouthit. All right, did he put his things in your room—or bring them with him?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he left them in the room.
MissDouthit. All right, you don't know where he put them?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; didn't pay any attention to him.
MissDouthit. Is there a closet in that room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
MissDouthit. You don't remember whether he hung his clothes in the closet?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. But, he left and came over where you were and signed your register, and then did he go back into his room or go down the hall and leave the house?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, went back in his room.
MissDouthit. All right. You don't know how long he stayed in his room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. Now, before he left your room, did he tell you anything aboutgoing and getting additional luggage, or did you know when he was leaving the room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I didn't know. He said he was going to get some groceries but it might have been that he said that he was going, I don't know. I don't know.
MissDouthit. Was it when he signed the register that he asked you about the grocery store, or later?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Later.
MissDouthit. All right. Then you were in your room when he went back in his room. Did you see him leave his room and go out of the house?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Yes.
MissDouthit. Then where did you go?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Lord have mercy. I don't know.
MissDouthit. Did you go back out in the yard?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I don't think I went into the yard. I was fooling around the house.
MissDouthit. All right, how far from your room is your kitchen?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, Lord. It is a long ways. It is clear across the living room and dining room and the kitchen is right there [indicating].
MissDouthit. All right, but your room is right next to the room you rented to this man?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
MissDouthit. When did you have knowledge that he was back in his room?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, when—I guess when he brought these—brought the milk in.
MissDouthit. How could he go to the grocery store and get milk unless he had already asked you where the grocery store was?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I guess he did, he had already.
MissDouthit. Okay, then, it was on his return from getting the bag that he asked you about the grocery store, is that right? Or do you remember?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, yes; it wasn't anything said about this when he rented—about eating. Just—he just rented the room, and not to eat in there.
MissDouthit. Now when you had some kind of knowledge, as you just said, could you hear him back in his room, or could you see him back in his room after he left the first time?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I heard him.
MissDouthit. Did he come in and talk to you before he left your house the second time?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; he never did talk to me at all. He didn't talk.
MissDouthit. The only conversation you had with this Mrs.—with this Mr. Oswald was when he came and rented the room and signed the register?
Mrs.Bledsoe. And what I got out of him. That's all I could get.
MissDouthit. Now; did you get any information out of him after he signed the register?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, the next day.
MissDouthit. I am talking about this one day.
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; didn't get much.
MissDouthit. Then all of your conversation that you had this Monday that he rented that room took place at one time, is that correct?
Mrs.Bledsoe. That's correct.
MissDouthit. Now, he came back, and for some reason you knew he was in there. When did he leave your house the second time?
Mrs.Bledsoe. When he went to get the groceries.
MissDouthit. Well, when?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I don't know.
MissDouthit. Was he—when he went to leave, did he come in and say, "I'm going to get some groceries." Did he?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No.
MissDouthit. You evidently told him about the grocery store the first time when he signed the register and your conversation withhim—
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I didn't either.
MissDouthit. Well, you just said you had one conversation with him, andyou had no other conversation with him. Now, just remember these facts that you had no conversation with him after he paid you the money and signed the register.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, I wouldn't say, because I don't know what he did. I don't remember.
MissDouthit. All right, how long after—when he brought his bag back and put it in this room, how long did he stay in that room until he left to go to the grocery store, if that is where he went?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Was that the first when he went and got the other bag?
MissDouthit. Uh-huh.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Well, 20 or 30 minutes.
MissDouthit. Did he go and use the telephone, or just stay in his room all that time?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No, didn't use the phone until—I think he used it after.
MissDouthit. Did he use your telephone on Monday?
Mrs.Bledsoe. After the, yes; after he got everything settled, I think he did. Two or three times every day. Called his wife, supposed to be.
MissDouthit. You don't know who he called?
Mrs.Bledsoe. No; I don't know who he called.
MissDouthit. But, you don't know anything at all about when you gave him this information about the grocery store? We are just trying to get the order here in which this happened, Mrs. Bledsoe, is all, if you can just remember?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Oh, Lord.
MissDouthit. That is the reason I asked you if you could, to write these things down.
Mrs.Bledsoe.Well——
MissDouthit. I am sorry, but I thought in—I might help you.
Mr.Jenner. Did he make a telephone call after he became settled?
Mrs.Bledsoe. Uh-huh.
Mr.Jenner. On the 8th of October?
Mrs.Bledsoe. I wouldn't say for sure, but I guess he did, because he called his wife, supposedly—supposed to have been all the time, but in the morning he called some people about jobs.
Mr.Jenner. Yes.
Mrs.Bledsoe. Because he talked on the phone and talked gruff, talked gruff to those on the phone, and talked about a job. I heard that.